# Forum Home Renovation Roofing  Leaking gutter joints

## Gilly4

*Have a couple of gutter joints which are leaking. Have resealed several times but after a year or two they leak again. The original installer appeared to have simply wiped some silicone on with his finger, nothing between the gutters themselves. Each time have cleaned off the old silicone removed any dirt and made sure it's dry and used grey roof silicone, but it so far has failed each time and the silicone easily peels off. The preparation has been thorough, am wondering as used turps to clean up maybe residue from that affects the bond. My question, should a more adhesive / sealant be used eg one of the Sika products like 11fc. Too big a job to remove the gutter and re install properly just want to affect a reasonable reseal that will last at least a few years. Thanks Peter.*

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## rebuildr86

the issue is silicone wont attach to an area tgat was siliconed because silicone doesnt stick to silocne and silicone remains on the surface when u removed the old stuff. nothing sticks to roofing silicone. The best thing is to use a large piece flashing tape which will bond to the gutter well to the side of the old silicone.

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## cyclic

1 Wipe away moisture
2 Wire brush the join thoroughly.
3 The join needs to be secure, so rivert the join if not already done. 3 riverts across the base and 2 each up the front and back, all close to the edge of the join inside the gutter.
4 Make sure the join is clean and dry, then apply lots of roof and gutter silicone (use sika if you want to) and wipe it thoroughly across the join and up the back and front of the gutter with your finger. 
If it is a tile roof, push a tile up the roof to get at the join.
Iron roof is harder to work on without cutting your hand/s.
And you can put silicone over silicone, just have to build it up.

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## phild01

Old silicone is difficult to remove thoroughly, this expensive product should help: https://www.bunnings.com.au/selleys-...mover_p1232412
Should not use turps, try acetone.

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## Gilly4

Thanks for all the suggestions. Clearly seems to me an adhesion problem. Gutter is securely riveted and have cleaned it up and applied plenty of roof silicone including up the sides but it eventually peels off. So will try silicone remover or acetone and perhaps  a combination of flashing tape and silicone sealant to it's edges on fresh gutter. That would have to work !!!!

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## phild01

> Thanks for all the suggestions. Clearly seems to me an adhesion problem. Gutter is securely riveted and have cleaned it up and applied plenty of roof silicone including up the sides but it eventually peels off. So will try silicone remover or acetone and perhaps  a combination of flashing tape and silicone sealant to it's edges on fresh gutter. That would have to work !!!!

  Sorry, wasn't implying acetone will remove silicone, just that turps leaves a residue (depending on type) whereas acetone will clean the surface properly after the silicone has thoroughly been removed.

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## RodEye

> Thanks for all the suggestions. Clearly seems to me an adhesion problem. Gutter is securely riveted and have cleaned it up and applied plenty of roof silicone including up the sides but it eventually peels off. So will try silicone remover or acetone and perhaps  a combination of flashing tape and silicone sealant to it's edges on fresh gutter. That would have to work !!!!

   Applying a combination of flashing tape and silicone sounds like a crazy idea to me. Another alternative product you could use is fillcoat fibre, but you may find the cost too prohibitive since you are only repairing a couple of joints.

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## METRIX

Don't bother with silicon, try Selleys STORM, this is one of Selleys new generation products based on Sil-X polymer technology it is not silicon based. 
It sticks to anything, wet or dry, even underwater, I have sealed gutters which were leaking with this stuff in the rain while water was running out the leak, stopped it immediately.
It stays pliable while wet, once the water stops flowing and it can dry out it cures to a tough flexible sealant. 
Best product I have ever seen besides 11FC, it is UV resistance and can even be painted over 
I had to use it to seal a rusted off gutter pop in a big storm because the water was leaking into the eaves (box gutter), there was a 5mm gap which had rusted out half way around the pop, it worked a treat, stopped the water immediately, I forgot about it and 1 year later it still hadn't leaked, now it's been repaired properly, I can say this is one product that actually does what it says.    Selleys storm sealant | Selleys Australia 
Actually the latest generation of Selleys products are fantastic, such as STORM, THE ONE, ArmourFlex,

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## phild01

Interesting you say that Metrix, I am now trying 'THE ONE'.  I am using it to adhere aluminium sheet to plywood.  Selley's technical assured me yesterday that it is perfect for this and is their latest technology and as you say not silicone and is not polyurethane. I asked if the product could be used to adhere bus panels like the more expensive Sika products.  Got a resounding 'yes' for that.  Your comments are reassuring as well.

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## rebuildr86

yeh even good old selleys all clear is different now. now paintable, even with alkyds. times are changing.
but the problem is, still, when u come across failed silicone, it has to be chemically removed before proceeding.

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## plum

> Don't bother with silicon, try Selleys STORM, this is one of Selleys new generation products based on Sil-X polymer technology it is not silicon based. 
> It sticks to anything, wet or dry, even underwater, I have sealed gutters which were leaking with this stuff in the rain while water was running out the leak, stopped it immediately.
> It stays pliable while wet, once the water stops flowing and it can dry out it cures to a tough flexible sealant. 
> Best product I have ever seen besides 11FC, it is UV resistance and can even be painted over 
> I had to use it to seal a rusted off gutter pop in a big storm because the water was leaking into the eaves (box gutter), there was a 5mm gap which had rusted out half way around the pop, it worked a treat, stopped the water immediately, I forgot about it and 1 year later it still hadn't leaked, now it's been repaired properly, I can say this is one product that actually does what it says.    Selleys storm sealant | Selleys Australia 
> Actually the latest generation of Selleys products are fantastic, such as STORM, THE ONE, ArmourFlex,

  Excellent stuff for a temp repair. I prefer Cyclic's method when performed properly for a permanent fix.

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## r3nov8or

*If you also have a pond to waterproof (because it comes in big tubs), you could use Crommelin Pond Sealer with their fibre tape for extra insurance*

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## Gilly4

Wow what a great lot of ideas, I'm scratching my head as what to go for. Will check out the products everyone has mentioned. For a small job it boils down to packaging sizes and so unit price, if I bought everything mentioned it would end up costing $100's of dollars to fix 2 leaking gutter joints; and frankly it doesn't rain that much in SA !!! 
I really appreciate everyone's input.     Cheers Peter.

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## Gilly4

Just for anyone interested I spoke to Selleys tech support about my problem and the new Storm sealant, was not recommended as does not stick well to silicone. The chap actually said the only thing that sticks to silicone is silicone and recommended staying with roof and gutter silicone. Food for thought and says something about this flash new wonder product. May have to go back to plan 1 whatever that was !!

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## rebuildr86

well that staff member is actually wrong. silicon doesnt srixk to silicone. i used to work for dulux group and have done the relevant courses on this. that staff member has missinterpreted a piece of information. new silicones by selleys can be recoated by themselves, but if u are looking at a an old bit of silicone now, chances are its not the new selleys silicone, so they should be recommending the std old fasioned approach of removing the silicone.
Flashing tape is designed for exactly the purpose u are asking about.

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## rebuildr86

although i can not stand American terminology, this yank has a good explanation in lamens terms. Will my new caulk stick to silicone?

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## Gilly4

Thanks rebuild86 , actually fits with my experience as I've done a thorough job,much like cyclic described, only to find that the new silicone peeled off. To me it's an adhesion problem so I bought some flashing tape today and will stick it over the joint, might seal its edge to the clean gutter with some silicone for extra security. Cheers

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## METRIX

> Interesting you say that Metrix, I am now trying 'THE ONE'.  I am using it to adhere aluminium sheet to plywood.  Selley's technical assured me yesterday that it is perfect for this and is their latest technology and as you say not silicone and is not polyurethane. I asked if the product could be used to adhere bus panels like the more expensive Sika products.  Got a resounding 'yes' for that.  Your comments are reassuring as well.

  
Yep, it's a great product but PHEW it's expensive

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## FrodoOne

> Gutter is securely riveted and have cleaned it up and applied plenty of roof silicone including up the sides but it eventually peels off.

  Are you sure that the gutter* is* securely riveted at more than 2 or 3 points. 
I have found the main reason for a siliconed joint failing is the movement of one section relative to the other, due to not quite good enough riveting and/or too few rivets. 
 Rivets at the top edges of the guttering are often omitted ! 
If you are going to clean it back to bare metal the only way you can really do this is to remove the rivets first. When you replace them it may be a good idea to increase their number, making sure that the top edges are riveted.

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## Gilly4

Thanks for your input FrodoOne, I know how I've physically cleaned up the joint and I can see and feel they're well riveted ( bit over the top to remove the rivets ) but it just don't stick which to me is an adhesion not a preparation problem. Will try the flashing tape and see if it sticks and breaches the joint. Seems to me everyone has different solutions as not a standard problem. Have listened to all the suggestions and conclude I need to find a a product that will adhere to the gutter, I'm quite confident that I can clean up the joint. We'll see  !!!

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## METRIX

Drill the rivets out, open the gutter join up, clean it, silicon inside the join, push them back together re rivet, then smooth the silicon over the join inside which squeezes out, you shouldn't have any issues after that.

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## phild01

A closeup picture would have been helpful.

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## Gilly4

Yes Metrex of course redoing the joint would be the preferred thing to do but a major job when the leaking joint is in the middle of 2 long runs of gutter with 3 down pipes attached and a couple of corners. I just don't want to pull all that down to correct the fact that originally no silicone was in the overlap . Looking for a fix with the gutter in situ, hence a botchy cover up !!

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## phild01

Doubt you would need to remove it all, once rivets removed there should be enough leeway to get the fix done.

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## plum

Flashing tape is a very amateurish fix in my opinion.

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## rebuildr86

yes it is but it works. 5 years and counting for me. (did it on a mates house at a 90 degree bend. and yes, this peraon is an amature, not a gutter installer so its perfect.

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## phild01

Whenever I have tried that flash tape stuff, it just falls off...doing something wrong but not sure what!

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## Uncle Bob

> I just don't want to pull all that down to correct the fact that originally no silicone was in the overlap . Looking for a fix with the gutter in situ, hence a botchy cover up !!

  I'd just do it in situ and I'm pretty sure that's what Metrix meant in this case also

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## Gilly4

Well I've patched it up in situ with flashing tape and silicone. Looks like a typical DIYers dodgy job but I reckon it will work. I'll let you all know in 5 years time how it lasts haha. Thanks for all the interest and helpful advice. Cheers Peter.

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## METRIX

> Yes Metrex of course redoing the joint would be the preferred thing to do but a major job when the leaking joint is in the middle of 2 long runs of gutter with 3 down pipes attached and a couple of corners. I just don't want to pull all that down to correct the fact that originally no silicone was in the overlap . Looking for a fix with the gutter in situ, hence a botchy cover up !!

  
You don't need to pull anything down, you do it while it's in place, very easy once the rivets drilled out, undo the brackets either side of the join this will allow you to open the join and fix it properly.

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## Gilly4

Agree if only fixed with brackets, bit more difficult when gutter is also attached to the fascia with a neat row of clouts and the iron projects nice and deeply into the gutter. Tricky to ease the gutter out without damage to self or gutter . Anyway job done so I'll be interested to see if it works better than previous efforts.

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