# Forum Home Renovation Rendering  Rendering over non-brick elements such as weatherboard and timber

## excalibr

Hi there, 
We are planning to get the façade rendered, but there are a number of non-brick elements such as: 
1. Weatherboard
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Assuming we cannot simply render over weatherboard, should it be replaced with some other type of cladding first? What do people tend to do here?  
Either way, what type of tradesmen do we engage here  unless a renderer can take care of everything? 
2. Timber beams and pillars
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The timber beams and pillars are rotting and need to be replaced. Given were rendering the façade, what are the options here, should these be replaced with fresh timber, or something else entirely that can be rendered? 
Perhaps this part needs a permit since this is structural work to the property? 
What type of tradesmen do we engage? 
Thanks very much,
John

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## joynz

The photo is quite dark, so a bit hard to give accurate advice. 
You can't render over weatherboards or wooden posts.  You could replace the weatherboard with styrene, which is designed to be rendered.  Not sure if the thickness would fit?   
Modern houses often have a mix of weatherboards and render, so you could just repaint the weatherboards, or use a feature cladding like Cemintel instead.  Cladding would be installed by a carpenter, usually. 
You might be able to box out the beams and posts with a material that can be rendered, but I would just replace and paint them in a colour that works with the house ( render colour or weatherboard contrast colour).

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## Arron

The weatherboard I'd be ripping off and replacing with Blueboard. Your renderer can render over it at the same time as rendering over the brickwork. It'll give the same finished look across both. 
From the photo, it looks like there may be no jointing required for the blueboard. 
A Carpenter will do the blueboard. 
I'm not sure about the posts and beam.

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## excalibr

Thanks fingers-crossed, we seem to have found a renderer who'd take care of the carpentry side as well

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## METRIX

> Thanks fingers-crossed, we seem to have found a renderer who'd take care of the carpentry side as well

  That's scary.

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## hotshot

> Thanks fingers-crossed, we seem to have found a renderer who'd take care of the carpentry side as well

  Everyone thinks they're a chippie *shakes head*

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## r3nov8or

Every tradie thinks no one else can do even the simplest aspects of their trade *shakes head*

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## METRIX

> Every tradie thinks no one else can do even the simplest aspects of their trade *shakes head*

  You obviously haven't seen how many dodgy fix up's chippies see every day, done by "so called" expert DIY or similar, personally I wouldn't trust a renderer to do any carpentry work, what about if something goes wrong and the render cracks where the work was done, do you call back the renderer and say, well you did the carpentry work, I'm sure the response would be well I'm not a chippy, the problem with render, is once it's done, there's no going back, if you have an issue you can't simply unscrew the render. 
I'm know the same goes for other trades, you only need to look at the many postings on here with dodgy timber work to see what I mean. 
I was only talking abut this yesterday with my neighbour, she has had some dodgy people do work on her place over the years, then got a qualified person to fix up the dodgy work who knew when he was doing.
Her words, there has to be a reason why any trade does a 4 year minimum qualification, like any job, but also having a qualification is never a guarantee of good workmanship, again like any job.

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## r3nov8or

> You obviously haven't seen how many dodgy fix up's chippies see every day, done by "so called" expert DIY or similar, personally I wouldn't trust a renderer to do any carpentry work, what about if something goes wrong and the render cracks where the work was done, do you call back the renderer and say, well you did the carpentry work, I'm sure the response would be well I'm not a chippy, the problem with render, is once it's done, there's no going back, if you have an issue you can't simply unscrew the render. 
> I'm know the same goes for other trades, you only need to look at the many postings on here with dodgy timber work to see what I mean. 
> I was only talking abut this yesterday with my neighbour, she has had some dodgy people do work on her place over the years, then got a qualified person to fix up the dodgy work who knew when he was doing.
> Her words, there has to be a reason why any trade does a 4 year minimum qualification, like any job, but also having a qualification is never a guarantee of good workmanship, again like any job.

  On the other hand, there are great examples of OBs who have personally built  their entire house from foundations to roof trusses and almost everything in between without any  qualifications at all. It comes down to acknowledging how much you don't  know and how much you are willing to learn. And a natural appitude for the tasks. 
In this case, it is  possible the renderer was once a chippie, or maybe he's just someone who  has built their own house, or extension and is happily confident to prepare some small walls  for blueboard. They may need very little attention, or a lot, to bring  them up to spec for new cladding. No biggie at all in my personal  experience.

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## excalibr

whoa, my bad, to clarify, the renderer has an actual chippie working for him

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## r3nov8or

Together they should be able to answer your questions re the posts and beams

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## hotshot

> Every tradie thinks no one else can do even the simplest aspects of their trade *shakes head*

  Thats not true. Anyone can do anything if they have time and attitude. But when you make half your money fixing mistakes you might understand.  I've done some rendering at my house, doesn't mean id sell those services. In my experience renderers are not the most multiskilled trade and you're lucky if they have a tape measure in their truck. and Ive met a lot of renderers in my time. 
I don't go the doctor if my computer has a virus. I go to the computer person.

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## r3nov8or

> ...
>   I go to the computer person.

   Is he/she 'qualified' or does he/she simply have an aptitude for computers and a will to learn? :P

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## Marc

Render is one of those jobs that require a specialist, it goes without saying. yes I have done some render myself and it came up surprisingly well. Pot luck probably, I wouldn't dream of offering rendering services for money. May be for free as a favour  :Smilie: 
But ... to excalibr ... why do you want to render the cladded part of those walls? It will not look right. You can render the bricks and leave the cladding as it is, that will keep that effect that is part of the house.
 If you want to render the cladded part you will need to remove the FC boards and replace it with flat Villaboard and render over it, leaving the step. If you want to make all leveled and render over the lot, you will inevitably have a crack where the bricks meet the FC, no matter what you do.
In your picture you have arrows pointing at the pergola post ... surely you don't want to render that do you?

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## r3nov8or

No one is disputing that a renderer should do the rendering.

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## METRIX

> On the other hand, there are great examples of OBs who have personally built  their entire house from foundations to roof trusses and almost everything in between without any  qualifications at all. It comes down to acknowledging how much you don't  know and how much you are willing to learn. And a natural appitude for the tasks. 
> In this case, it is  possible the renderer was once a chippie, or maybe he's just someone who  has built their own house, or extension and is happily confident to prepare some small walls  for blueboard. They may need very little attention, or a lot, to bring  them up to spec for new cladding. No biggie at all in my personal  experience.

  A lot of assumptions there, and you know what they say about assumptions ! 
My view is if your a plumber, your a specialist in that field, sure you might be able to put a noggin in here and there to put your plumbing on that's fine, or you might be able to hack the studs to bits to put your plumbing in because your a bad plumber, and not think anything of it, that's not fine, I have seen this done on outside jobs I have been called to. 
As a plumber or sparkie you might also be able to build a deck if your interested in that type of thing, I have built plenty of decks for plumbers, painters, sparkies because they are specialists in their own right, and they know they offer a professional job to others in their field, but they engaged me to do the same for them because building is my specialist field and they want a level of finish they know they may not be able to achieve, same as I call in a plumber or sparkie because that's their speciality. 
I know I can wire up a new circuit, install a two way switch or add power points, I can even add a tap here and there as brazing is easy, it's not rocket science, it doesn't mean I am allowed to do that, or I'm doing it correctly, I have my test and Tag license, and plug top replacement cert, but that doesn't mean I can do anything with electrical, and honestly I'm not interested in doing it as I would prefer a sparkie to do this for me as I know it's done right. 
Yes OB can do a lot of stuff, just like anyone, but they can also do a lot of stuff wrong because of lack of experience and knowledge, and taking a guess at how to do something, or not wanting to spend the money to get the right advice or help to do it correctly, after all this is why most OB are trying to do it themselves because they think the tradies are going to rip them off. 
It's fine to say there are many great examples of OB building their own house, thats great, the issue there is it took them 18 months or more to finish their house, where a specialised builder can achieve the same or better finish in 6 months. 
I do disagree with your comment about every trade thinks no other trade can do the simplest aspects of their job, tradies by nature are hands on people, unlike office workers who sit behind a computer and push pens, the tradies I know are very resourceful people because it comes with the nature of the job, they can work their way through simple problems with other trades without any fuss, but anything advanced they will call the expert. 
In regards to specialists, IMO a good carpenter is the most resourceful and knowledgeable person on site outside of their specialist field, they not only need to know about their specialist field of timber structures which involves floors, walls and roof, including structural elements, spans, timber sizes, timber treatments, trusses, but they need to have a good knowledge of form work, insulation, gyprock, metal and tile roofing, guttering installation, Reduced Level, doors, hinges, locks, windows (fitments and repair), flooring, cladding, termite protection, skirting, architraves, jambs, glazing fitment, kitchen installations, bathroom preparations, demolition, stairs, balustrades, the list goes on and on,

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## r3nov8or

> A lot of assumptions there, and you know what they say about assumptions ! 
> My view is if your a plumber, your a specialist in that field, sure you might be able to put a noggin in here and there to put your plumbing on that's fine, or you might be able to hack the studs to bits to put your plumbing in because your a bad plumber, and not think anything of it, that's not fine, I have seen this done on outside jobs I have been called to. 
> As a plumber or sparkie you might also be able to build a deck if your interested in that type of thing, I have built plenty of decks for plumbers, painters, sparkies because they are specialists in their own right, and they know they offer a professional job to others in their field, but they engaged me to do the same for them because building is my specialist field and they want a level of finish they know they may not be able to achieve, same as I call in a plumber or sparkie because that's their speciality. 
> I know I can wire up a new circuit, install a two way switch or add power points, I can even add a tap here and there as brazing is easy, it's not rocket science, it doesn't mean I am allowed to do that, or I'm doing it correctly, I have my test and Tag license, and plug top replacement cert, but that doesn't mean I can do anything with electrical, and honestly I'm not interested in doing it as I would prefer a sparkie to do this for me as I know it's done right. 
> Yes OB can do a lot of stuff, just like anyone, but they can also do a lot of stuff wrong because of lack of experience and knowledge, and taking a guess at how to do something, or not wanting to spend the money to get the right advice or help to do it correctly, after all this is why most OB are trying to do it themselves because they think the tradies are going to rip them off. 
> It's fine to say there are many great examples of OB building their own house, thats great, the issue there is it took them 18 months or more to finish their house, where a specialised builder can achieve the same or better finish in 6 months. 
> I do disagree with your comment about every trade thinks no other trade can do the simplest aspects of their job, tradies by nature are hands on people, unlike office workers who sit behind a computer and push pens, the tradies I know are very resourceful people because it comes with the nature of the job, they can work their way through simple problems with other trades without any fuss, but anything advanced they will call the expert. 
> In regards to specialists, IMO a good carpenter is the most resourceful and knowledgeable person on site outside of their specialist field, they not only need to know about their specialist field of timber structures which involves floors, walls and roof, including structural elements, spans, timber sizes, timber treatments, trusses, but they need to have a good knowledge of form work, insulation, gyprock, metal and tile roofing, guttering installation, Reduced Level, doors, hinges, locks, windows (fitments and repair), flooring, cladding, termite protection, skirting, architraves, jambs, glazing fitment, kitchen installations, bathroom preparations, demolition, stairs, balustrades, the list goes on and on,

  Heard it all before and I can't bothered responding

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## hotshot

> Is he/she 'qualified' or does he/she simply have an aptitude for computers and a will to learn? :P

  Sorry I should have had said IT professional.

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## METRIX

> Heard it all before and I can't bothered responding

  Why not, you seem to have plenty to say about everything else, is that's because your a renovator you already know everything about everything, right ?

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## r3nov8or

> Sorry I should have had said IT professional.

  I'm one of those, but do virus work for beer in my spare time.

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## r3nov8or

> Why not, you seem to have plenty to say about everything else, is that's because your a renovator you already know everything about everything, right ?

  _I_ have plenty to say?  :Rolleyes:    

> is that's because your a renovator you already know  everything about everything, right ?

  Having done 20 years of extending and renovating my own homes and helping others, and having only ever engaged plumbers and electricians, I reckon I know enough to get by.

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## Marc

I work in an office but I don't push pens ... actually I don't know anyone that does ...  :Smilie:

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## notvery

> I work in an office but I don't push pens ... actually I don't know anyone that does ...

  no instead of pushing pens you pull the strings of your 15 dentists working on your multi storied dental practice.. and making them coffee twice a day... the picture is building up of you Marc. im seeing some sort of Clive Palmer style dental baron and once youve ruined the local environment with your waste fillings, extracted teeth, plaque scrapings and damaged dentures you claim bankruptcy an leave the local council to clean up the mess while you move onto a bigger and more multi storied dental practice just up the road.
am i close?

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## Marc

I like to help you out ... which way did you come in?
This is better:
I saw you kicking a can down the street and asked what are you doing? ... you said I am moving.
Yes both are jokes yet your post is rather pathetic. Do you still love nature despite what it did to you?

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## r3nov8or

> Do you still love nature despite what it did to you?

  I'll be using that one!

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## Marc

One more:
-I don't know what your problem is, but I'll bet it's hard to pronounce  :Rofl5:

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## METRIX

> I work in an office but I don't push pens ... actually I don't know anyone that does ...

  Although there are still Pen Pushers around, perhaps they need to update the term to keyboard pusher, instead of pushing paperwork, its now pushing emails  :Biggrin:  
By definition: A Pen Pusher is a person with a clerical job involving lots of tedious and repetitive paperwork.

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## METRIX

> _I_ have plenty to say?

  Yes, so I've heard   :Tongue:     

> Having done 20 years of extending and renovating my own homes and helping others, and having only ever engaged plumbers and electricians, I reckon I know enough to get by.

  There you go, that didn't take much effort  :Tongue:

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## r3nov8or

> Yes, so I've heard      
> There you go, that didn't take much effort

  shhhhhh

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## r3nov8or

> a ...  job involving lots of tedious and repetitive ...work.

   A carpenter

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## Marc

> Although there are still Pen Pushers around, perhaps they need to update the term to keyboard pusher, instead of pushing paperwork, its now pushing emails  
> By definition: A Pen Pusher is a person with a clerical job involving lots of tedious and repetitive paperwork.

   Neee, not me, I don't push keyboards. Press keys perhaps but not tedious nor repetitive by any stretch of the imagination.

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## Marc

> A carpenter

   Ha ha, I remember a pommy carpenter that used to work with me that was very prolific in producing quotes and says. He used to say that carpentry is "repetition, repetition"  :Smilie:  
But I do know plenty of email pushers. So many justify their position by forwarding other people's email so that you get 3-4-5 times the same email forwarded by different self appointed expert. I solved the problem by making a dozen rules in my email so those get straight to trash. Love it.  
What were we talking about? Clive Palmer?  :Rofl5: 
Yes, I remember taking a lot of grief when I said I was friends with Rene Rivkin. A great bloke, miss him a lot. 
The amount of bias and prejudice among seemingly average folks is massive, mostly inflicted upon them by peers family and media. Oh well ... it's all part of the fun.

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## METRIX

> A carpenter

  You seemed to delete a word, being paper, as in paper work, I do push a lot of electronic paperwork, being invoices to people for work performed, so I don;t mind pushing these because they magically convert to money  :Biggrin:

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## r3nov8or

> You seemed to delete a word, being paper, as in paper work, I do push a lot of electronic paperwork, being invoices to people for work performed, so I don;t mind pushing these because they magically convert to money

  Yeah, I had a bit of a play with your quote.  
I immediately find this banter totally cool, as I've just read Inter and Ringtail going at it in the Joining Posts thread!

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## METRIX

> I've just read Inter and Ringtail going at it in the Joining Posts thread!

  Again  :Biggrin:   :Tongue:   :Biggrin:

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## ringtail

Oh this is much more interesting though. Love those quotes Marc. Knowing Rene does you no favours though. Now we know you have a 300 foot yacht full of $100k dental chairs  :Biggrin:

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## METRIX

This is Marc's workplace, Very German like precision, although Hungary is know as having the best dentistry in the world, even the Swiss and Germans go there. High quality dental treatments in Hungary | Hungarian Dental Travel 
Marc would have a Wally yacht, I know I would if I had Març's resources  :Tongue:  
Last pic is one of their Super Yachts, look at the size of the boom   :Eek: , not sure how you would go at rendering over that one possibly some extra bondcrete (keeping it on topic)

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## ringtail

Yep, that has Marc written all over it  :Biggrin: . In fact, I think that's Marc working on that sail

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## Marc

Actually, I dislike sail boats. Too much draft, too cramped living space, you spend more in sails than in fuel etc etc.
This is my choice of boat and design, a true blue waters passagemaker. Does use a small sail for stability and to help the engine along when possible. Plenty of living space small engine sipping fuel, go anywhere. 
Diesel duck by George Buehler

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## Marc

> ... Knowing Rene does you no favours though...

  Ha ha, I know that but who needs that sort of 'favours'?

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## ringtail

> Actually, I dislike sail boats. Too much draft, too cramped living space, you spend more in sails than in fuel etc etc.
> This is my choice of boat and design, a true blue waters passagemaker. Does use a small sail for stability and to help the engine along when possible. Plenty of living space small engine sipping fuel, go anywhere. 
> Diesel duck by George Buehler

  So, a trawlerman dentist. Interesting.

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## JS001

I would leave the weatherboard as a feature to break up the render. You can render over Blue Board - use acrylic render but as soon as there is a bit of moisture or movement it will start to break up.

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## Black Cat

Getting back on track, I had a weatherboard house in Queensland (Woolloongabba, little elevated Queenslander style thing) that had had various alterations and changes to openings over the years, none of which were apparent from the outside as they had stretched chicken wire over the weatherboards and applied render over the chicken wire. Worked a treat - must have been done in around the '30s and was only just starting to fail a bit during my period of occupation. 
That said, the style of your house relies on the articulation and the texture - the timber and brick elements are designed to counterbalance each other. So I would avoid rendering over the weatherboard bits if it were me.

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## r3nov8or

If I was going to modernise this house l think I would render the brick and replace the angled weather boards with horizontal pre-finished natural timber weather boards / cladding 
(not a great example but you get the idea)

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