# Forum Home Renovation Decking  Oils aint Oils - Natural vs Modern - Help pls?

## me3_neuralfibre

Time to re-oil the deck. UteMad and JimJ - love your work.  
It's high set, 90mm Kwila on Spotted Gum, laid at 45deg, with stainless screws. Fully covered. In Brisbane climate.  
Originally let to rain out the tannins for a month or so, then coated with 3 coats of Cabots Natural oil - clear. 
Then the roof went on. 
The Cabots goes "brown" and "dirty" after 12mths. Maybe it's just dirt, but I reckon it's the oil oxidising.  
For the railings I used Cutek CD50, which soaked in and worked very well. It needs another coat after 12mths in the sun, the tops of railings have a hard time.  
So after I clean the deck (aka Napisan etc) - what oh what do I use. 
It must be an "oil" - that is - soak in. I do not want to ever sand this thing.  
So apart from Cutek - what oils are out there that are "better" than Cabots and won't go as brown? Is there some way to keep that "shiny deep red" finish simply by hosing and oiling every 12mths? 
Thanx
Paul

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## jimj

The question that you have asked is one of the most common asked and hardest to answer. I have reached the conclusion that there is no universally best product that does it all. Each product has its good attributes and its bad. We the poor old consumers have to wade through the myriad of brochures and hype that we hear and read and then pick the one we think fits the bill. I do know that the oil in Cabots decking oil is just 60% by volume kerosine. Most of the kerosine based oils that I visit turn black over time. They can also remain very sticky taking a lot of time to dry out.
I can't comment on Feast and Watson but I know it is utemads preferred decking oil and he has coated 100s of decks with it. 
You might also want to consider the Cutek range as you can see how it has served you on your handrails. I would, however, steer clear of anything that is based with an organic based oil. I have found that most of them will attract mould which will want to feed on the oil and your deck goes black.  Although being under a roof line would slow this process down . 
All in all exterior timber can be a challenge to maintain with all of the environmental challenges encountered. 
Good luck   and please keep the forum updated as there will be many people out there wanting to read and learn from your experiences. 
jimj

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## me3_neuralfibre

The Cutek has it's advantages, but it's expensive and really soaks in. It also does silver fairly quickly.  
I'm thinking Intergrain Ultradeck may be the go.  
Sikkens - I can't figure out their product range.  
I have seen a product - Cooee that looked ok - but it was on garden furniture when I saw it.  
Paul

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## jimj

By far the greatest challenge to all timber and coatings is the amount of the sun uv it gets. If your deck is under the roof line it is better than a fully exposed deck. 
If you get the intergrain brochure they show a timeline as to how long they feel theirt coatings will last. The coating called DWD lasts the vlongest and in my opinion one of the worst products I encounter if in the sun. Under roof line and protected nearly stays perfect. In the sun it bubbles,blisters,peels and delaminates. Ultradeck in the sun after 12-14 months goes a little patchy. I havn't seen it peel or blister however.  I have sanded it off several times and can't be certain if it can be cleaned off chemically very easy. Perhaps others with more experience can comment. 
jimj

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## me3_neuralfibre

Hi JimJ 
As you are doing restores - do you see a clear difference between "oils" and "coatings"? 
I figured on 2 totally different concepts, but it sounds like you see some overlap? 
I've only used oils outdoors before, never a coating product.  
Thanx
Paul

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## Blocker

Paul,
I would suggest scrubbing with wood cleaner of your choice, prior to recoating, to lessen darkening effect of oil build up.Most turps based deck oils last about the same(regardless of advertising claims).
I would suggest a turps based Deck Stain as it will last a bit longer than oils.Sikkens HLS or any other brand will work ok.Choose a colour closest to your timber colour,and this will help hide variations in substrate colour.
Regards,
Blocker :2thumbsup:

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## jimj

I would agree with Blocker as Sikkens cetol hls is thinner that cetol deck and comes in a variety of tint colours. I am not certain of the oil that is used in hls but it does seem to soak in a little. I can say that sikkens Cetol deck is thicker and only comes in naural which is quite a dark brow honey colour. Although it is oil based ( not sure of the oil) it doesn;t soak in but just sits on top of the wood forming a film on the wood. It is very high gloss and will turn yellow,crack and then peel if regular maintenance isn't kept up to date. 
I have sanded many decks with both cetol deck and cetol hls. Trying to remove cetol  deck with chemical stripper and high pressure water is diabolically messy. I havn't tried to remove hls in any other manner except sanding so i can;t comment on how to remove it chemically. I would avoid anything that is based on tung oil,lanolin,linseed and I also saw a deck coated in canola oil. All go black where rain hits it and the mould comes in. 
I realise this discussion can become very convoluted and confusing. In the end I have reached the conclusion that those products that soak in don't soak in that far if it is dense hardwood decking. I have sanded off both soaking oils and film products. You only need to go down 1-1.5 mm to reach to and clean timber. Although hls is regarded as a soaking oil due to its thin viscosity I have seen several decks in full sun coated with it and it definitely peels. 
I have chosen to use a water based acyrlic as it doesn't peel,blister or delaminate. It dries in 10-15 minutes and washes out with water. Hadly smells and recoats in several hours. Most people I work for just want something that is easy for them to maintain and easy to use. 
I guess in the end you will select something that you feel comfortable to apply,gives the look you want and happy with its maintenance regime and cleaning capablilities. 
good luck 
jimj

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## me3_neuralfibre

> I have chosen to use a water based acyrlic as it doesn't peel,blister or  delaminate. It dries in 10-15 minutes and washes out with water. Hadly  smells and recoats in several hours. Most people I work for just want  something that is easy for them to maintain and easy to use.

  Which Acrylic JimJ? 
I have some HLS testing on the underside of my table at the moment. Damp weather at the moment, but it's still on top, and sticky, after 3 days.  
Thanx
Paul

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## Blocker

Because of the residual decking oil,I would hesitate using a water based coating at this point.Sikkens HLS is a conventional oil stain,similar to Feast Watson Decking Stain,Haymes Deck and Timber Stain etc..
Acrylic stains will last longer than oil stains,but look more artificial and are more difficult to re-do once they break down.
Curing/Drying times in good weather are around 7-14 days and double this in damp or humid weather.
Acrylic stains can still feel quite clammy to walk on with bare feet for up to 4-6 weeks.
Regards,
Blocker :2thumbsup:

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## jimj

I use Flood Spa&Deck mainly Jarrah tint and never natural tint.
 I agree with Blocker that it will mask some of the grain and not look quite as natural as other products. Maintenance is still required and to remove it sanding is best. It is just a question of pros vs cons. 
You can have a look at my web site which shows spa&deck in the portfolio page. There are 25 before and after photos. All the afters are spa&deck. 
jimj     Restore-A-Deck :: decks timber restoration maintenance jetty boardwalk fences

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## me3_neuralfibre

Looking at the Flood / Sikkens / Intergrain sites, they all have water based options.  
I assume the water based is an acrylic.  
The "oils" I know can't flake, as they are not a surface film.  
Is there a water based that is just as "safe"?
The thought of sanding the deck sends me running in fear. 
I'm very nervous of anything water based. 
This may be an irrational fear.  
The Flood Spa and Deck looks too muddy for my taste JimJ, but it could be the pictures. ie redder, but grain less visible?
They have some other products though that look interesting. Again, some oil, some acrylic. I'll have to see what's in Oz, as the US site seems to have a wider range. 
Thanx
Paul

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## kevviek

So what does everyone think of Acquadeck. I'm about to do a deck in spotted gum...

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## jimj

If you think that Sikkens can't flake you are very mistaken. Both Sikkens cetol deck and HLS are oil and when in full sun crack,peel and flake. Even though they are oil they sit on top of the wood as a film. Yes the Flood range in the US is much bigger and so is the number of people and competitors. I would say that the oil might look better to the eye initially but in the sun they don't hold up as well as spa&deck. It is guranteed to not crack or peel for 2 years in full sun. It doesn't. In my opinion it all comes down to what is more appealing in the pros and cons department. 
Cabots Aquadeck in full sun can go rather patchy in full sun in around 12-14 months. Others will probably  have a different opinion. 
There is no such thing as the worlds best decking coating  including Flood Spa&Deck. I have to select something to put on my customers decks who are generally fairly upset about the entire deck coating story. I very rarely ever get called back due to the spa&deck not performing.  
jimj  restore-a-deck

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## ringtail

I will only use aquadeck now, after years of forking out big $$$ for sikkens on my own decks, and seeing customers decks finished in everything from clay with pure gum turps ( organ oil) to feast and watson. I can honestly say that there is next to no difference in the water based vs oil based ( sikkens, feast vs aqudeck). No product is perfect, no product is maintenance free, and none will  last more than 12 months in the sun. I would rather pay $ 130 for 10 lt of aquadeck and get 3 coats on in one day, then 1 the next day, than pay $ 300 for sikkens and put the product on over 4 days only to have it look as bad as the aqudeck in the same time.

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## jimj

amen! the only difference is in the product used  but the sentiments are the same! 
jimj

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