# Forum More Stuff Go to Whoa!  The "Volunteered" Bathroom

## an3_bolt

Well - I got volunteered by the rest of the family to fix up a bathroom in the family beach house. So I thought I might share a few mistakes, enlightenments and observations that I have had on the way so far. 
The original building was constructed by the "old man" and myself some 25 years ago when I was in high school. Neither of us had any background in building - and owner building was a bit different 25 years ago to what it has become today. Ironically I had absolutely no interest in building houses or painting or anything of the like. All I wanted was to hit the garage on school holidays to make windsurfers and surfboards ...... how things change with age and time! 
So I find myself on forced leave from my current work (they are burning up employees long service leave and outstanding annual leave prior to retrenchments...) and I find myself "volunteered" to redo a bathroom. Possibly a thinly veiled plot by the good "Mrs" to keep my mind away from the other workplace..... 
A picture is a thousand words - Attachment 91178Attachment 91179Attachment 91180
......functional but dated. Still in working form.....I can even remember my mother laying the tiles. 
The project brief was to update and make the bathroom more accessible for both the small kids that we have running around these days and the oldies with the hip replacements etc. We settled on the concept of a open walk in shower draining to a shower channel, and a smaller sized bath in the corner. Of course the room has a new WC and a new wall mount vanity to go as well. Tiling on walls to ceiling with square set.  *PHASE 1: Testing.* 
$100 for testing some samples for asbestos. Results negative - continue.  *PHASE 2: Demolition.* 
Fun. 2 days of smashing and breaking and throwing into a 3m3 skip. Progressed well until: Attachment 91181
...Black ants nest. Wrecked their day - but 2 more days of remedial framing work. 
Flooring - not happy - up it comes. 
Ceiling. Plasterboard does not run to studs - ie a gap and cornice. For square set - not good enough. Out it comes. 
The project is getting bigger and bigger :Doh: :  Attachment 91182  *PHASE 3: Plumbing and electrical.* 
The whole area has problems with copper corrosion. Decision is made whilst walls are open to replace with PEX. Electrical for room redone. Project is getting bigger! And more expensive! 
Ceiling lights were changed to downlights GU10 LED 7W - Phillips Masters in 2700K (very similar to a 50W halogen) and a ceiling fan / heat lamp thingy with exhaust duct to outside.  *PHASE 4: Re-sheeting* 
Hang on.......check wall studs..... :No:  1 full day of planing and packing to get walls straight..... 
On to areas that I enjoy. Dropped in new floor of 15mm compressed cement (properly joined with Megapoxy P1) and screwed. Placed Rondo furring channels on ceiling via clips off ceiling joists. Very quick and easy when using a laser leveller and wall tracks for the battens to drop into. Left enough room for any future rewiring under the joists. Relined ceiling with aquacheck and then relined the walls with villaboard. Joints at floor/wall and corners sealed as per manufacturers instructions.  Attachment 91183Attachment 91184 
Good time to paint ceiling - so a coat of sealer and then 2 coats of the Zinzzer ceiling. My paint friend recommended the Zinzzer - I liked using it - good coverage and thickness/hiding power but time will tell. Short 6mm nap gave a great finish. Previously been using the Dulux Bathroom with good success. Best way I have found to paint around the lights is to pull them down and either wrap them in cling wrap or place a sandwich bag over them (they are LED!! - don't do that with a Halogen) and just roll away :Sneaktongue:   *PHASE 5: Bath frame* 
The decision to island mount the small bath (1500 x 700) was so that any remedial work in future is easy to access with minimal damage to any waterproofing and other structure.
Hebel was very quick and easy to use - and after using it for the bath support - will never use timber again for this. The Hebel  is just too easy and solid.  *PHASE 6: Screed* 
The tiler did his own screed. Used a sand/cement mix, with a slip sheet and reinforcing. All great. 
But not so great! Winter - temperatures a little cool and relative humidity too high. Screed taking excessive amount of time to dry. Not a summer problem - but just a problem now as we wanted to get it moving ASAP. Time fixes most things - so a bit more waiting........and a bit more... :Cold:  
In frustration I contacted the the technical rep for the waterproofing compound I was going to use - they suggested using an epoxy moisture seal and then can get on with the waterproofing. :Fixed:  
Note to self - if I am ever doing this again in winter - use a polymer modified screed such as Ultrascreed as can get onto it in several hours and get waterproofing ASAP.   *PHASE 7: Waterproofing* 
At this stage I can just picture Oldsaltoz giggling uncontrollably  :Lolol: .......but it is favourite aspect for me as I consider myself moderately anal retentive attempting perfection!!! Just ask me... 
This time I am using the Bostik Dampfix Gold - elastameric class 3 membrane with good resistance to chemicals. But most importantly as it is compatible with the adhesives the tiler intends on using. No problem - used similar before by another manufacturer..... 
Wrong. Cue more Oldsaltoz giggles........ 
Do you think it would dry with the recommended 1000um (1mm) wet application.......gotta be kidding! It is winter with 100% Relative Humidity or close to overnight between 5pm and 9am. Have a look at the met office data! 
But slow success.....Attachment 91185Attachment 91186Attachment 91187 
Key points include using neutral cure silicon for the bond breakers at correct coving, using a wet film thickness gauge regularly to get proper depth of liquid applied membrane, using a shower channel that has tiling flanges with appropriate "weep holes", flanges at tap penetrations, lots of swearing, throwing some extra liquid where not required as i know what my kids do - let alone my sisters and quick recovery of Iphone when it went "splot"  :Shock: out of top pocket onto the floor (lucky it had cover on it that went straight under the hose..). This stuff is seriously gold in colour.
....note to self ......get grey colour if I have to do this again as looking at gold for too long with all the lights on is seriously annoying. 
Couple of tips from the tech rep - take note of substrate temperature - this will definitely effect drying rates, as well as the effect of ambient air temperature and relative humidity. Over temperature flashes off too quickly and at too cooler temps this stuff will crystallise and become brittle/crack - if it gets too cool while it has been applied in liquid form. Once cured it retains the flexibility of the class 3 at low temperature. 
On a note from my experience - the advertised drying and re-coat times of these type of products are at optimum conditions - which is far from usual. Allow extra time from what the manufacturer specifies on the instructions.  *PHASE 8: Tiling.* 
Mr Tiler Man - booked in for next end of next week - which is great as it will give the waterproofing a while to cure correctly. 
More to come! Cheers!

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## Oldsaltoz

Your right, I did have chuckle or two. 
Lets hope the tiler has a good run. 
Good luck.  :Smilie:

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## an3_bolt

....didn't mention it before - but you would probably get a good laugh out of the fact that I litterly got stuck to the membrane.... Stood in one spot for too long whilst not fully cured. Had to take off sneakers and slowly unstick them...... :Doh:  Rookie error...

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## Oldsaltoz

> ....didn't mention it before - but you would probably get a good laugh out of the fact that I litterly got stuck to the membrane.... Stood in one spot for too long whilst not fully cured. Had to take off sneakers and slowly unstick them...... Rookie error...

  Now you know what the silly looking plastic over shoes are for, I would have sent you some if I thought would do that. Don't feel too bad I managed to leave a scraper on the membrane and had to full repair before I could leave the job.
At least I walk on it after only 20 minutes so need the plastics. 
Well done.   :Smilie:

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## an3_bolt

Tiling done by.....tiler did a pretty good job - including lots of "jolly cuts" / mitring for around the bath and wall external corner. 
Got the bath in - island mounted for any problems down the track. Packed with insulation. Of course a joist sits exactly where the bath waste would vertically penetrate - so a bit of creative plumbing to move around it.  Attachment 91441Attachment 91442Attachment 91443 
Of course everything always takes longer than you think - with tasks such as buffing off any haze from grouting, silicon for wall/floor joints and corners, installing taps and mini cocks for cisterns etc, mounting vanity carcass, fixing vanity carcass, drilling holes in tiles, mounting toilet pan etc etc. 
Finally getting there - about another days work left in it - seal grout, mount stone and basin on vanity carcass, rip some packers for the architraves to mount on........and christen the dunny!

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## an3_bolt

Nothing is easy......... 
Seems like it has been a bit of fight from time to time.... 
Possibly a good example is the vanity "the old chook" bought - good looking vanity to the untrained eye and also at a very good price. 
On closer inspection - it would appear that it is really not a very high strength vanity carcass - with the top rear of the vanity scalloped out for some reason. This makes it quite hard to wall mount and required a few impromptu mods to increase rigidity and ultimate bearing strength. Of course the extra plates I installed in the wall went out the window as this was exactly where the vanity carcass has the rear scalloped out...   Attachment 91611 
Note to self once again - ensure a proper carcass design for wall hung vanity prior to closing out the walls - go back to mr kitchen man who I used for the ones in my house. But stone top worked well......after an extra hole so that the tap could be tightened properly from underneath. This is the hazard for obtaining separate items from separate supplies and purchasing conducted by someone else......attempting to make it all fit!  Attachment 91609Attachment 91610Attachment 91612 
Grout sealed - not much to finish it off now.....as holidays are over and back to work!

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## SlowMick

awesome effort sir.  the bathroom looks amazing.  and you made me feel better about the fight that my bathroom and my sisters bathroom put up.

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## an3_bolt

Thanks Mick - Appreciated. 
In hindsight - I think the fight was more related to discovering problems that were unexpected - such as remedial framing for out of plum walls, ant damage to timber, flimsy vanity carcass, copper corrosion in the pipes etc. Some of it was possibly due to the required integration of already purchased items by my mother into the design, and working around the existing structure such as windows. If time and money was unlimited - I would have changed windows, walls and doors into a new concept. Reality is that this is a holiday house used by our extended families - which does not justify the extra expense. 
I have found one of the keys for myself to doing a bathroom is creating the correct order of construction and visualising each key event and how to do it. For me - it really does take a lot of pre-planning, right down to sourcing required materials in advance, as I hate stopping work to run around to find something I need.  
In this particular instance my planning did not allow for all the remedial work that was needed - some of it could be just covered over - and I imagine that is what a builder would have to do to actually make money out of doing these things - but my time is not money (just love!) so it took a lot longer than I anticipated.  
Again - another occasion to learn. That is why I have wanted to share these things and document it - so that others may be able to not make the same mistakes (as flimsy vanities etc) and gain knowledge from what i have learnt. Better to work smarter - not harder, and a lot of it comes down to the 5 P's (Prior planning prevents poor performance). 
Now my sister wants me to come and help her with hers :Doh:  Maybe if I get retrenched from work.......but that will probably mean moving the family overseas again to keep working!

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## SlowMick

My sister had water leaking from the shower into the kitchen.  by the time we stripped out the bathroom two of the walls didn't touch the slab.  She couldn't get any of the bathroom renovation companies out to give her a quote (her area suggests she has no cash).  We are still talking even though it took me six months while i was working full time.  Price must have been right.  Builders must have to work hard to make money on these rooms - i guess a lot can be hidden in the thickness of glue holding on the wall tiles.  :Rolleyes:

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