# Forum Home Renovation Plumbing  Testing for gas leaks with cigarette lighter

## paddyjoy

I know enough to know that this is not the *right* thing to do but is it something pretty standard with gas fitting? or do I need to use a different plumber next time?

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## plum

Wtf ?

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## paddyjoy

> Wtf ?

  Thanks Plum I'll interpret that as use somebody else next time! 
He extended the gas line in our kitchen, soldered in a new elbow and added a new section of copper, turned the gas back on and used a lighter all around the elbow to check for leaks. Think the reasoning was that it was more accurate but can't recall exactly.

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## plum

Pretty dumb really, by rights the whole fitting line should be tested before any work is done, if it's sound, do the work required, then pressure test again. He's leaving himself wide open for any issues that may occur. 
You have to walk away from a job knowing that there is no leaks and it's all sound. Personally I don't think I could sleep at night, thinking, 'what if'.

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## watson

or wondering where your hair went after the bang........ :Biggrin:

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## paddyjoy

> Personally I don't think I could sleep at night, thinking, 'what if'.

  Either will I now  :Wink:

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## Rip it up

Generally a soapy water test is the best. Any leaks show up as little raspberry bubbles. 5 drops into a 750ml spray bottle is heaps.  
This is from a gas field poly pipe welder. 500mm pipes etc.  
Cheers Damo.

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## plum

Now, Rip it up, the idea of a pressure test is to test all the fitting line  because once you alter or extend a fitting line, you take responsibility for the WHOLE installation.

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## Random Username

Are you sure it wasn't this guy? Cookies must be enabled | Herald Sun

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## Godzilla73

The Old Skool Plumber where i used to work did this all the time, along with disconnecting and capping off without turning the mains off. He claimed all it'd do was pop and fart a bit if it was leaking. I always stood outside when he was around, he also used to light his oxy with his darts too. Nice old bloke, but how he's still alive i have no idea...

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## plum

> The Old Skool Plumber where i used to work did this all the time, along with disconnecting and capping off without turning the mains off. He claimed all it'd do was pop and fart a bit if it was leaking. I always stood outside when he was around, he also used to light his oxy with his darts too. Nice old bloke, but how he's still alive i have no idea...

  
Just an example of how dangerous not turning the gas off and working under pressure, call it old skool or what you want, this bloke attempted to grease a gas cock under pressure, unbeknowns to him the gas line he was working on was operating above normal pressure and he was unable to re-install the valve. With gas escaping, a pilot light ignited the gas an explosion occurred in one of our famous car manufacturing canteens at Fishermans Bend. Put him in hospital for a while and totalled the canteen. 
Just saying can't be too lax when working with gas.

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## intertd6

They say that stupidity is infinite, much like the universe, but they are not 100% sure about the universe, you need another plumber, no matter how cheap that one is.
regards inter

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## Bloss

> They say that stupidity is infinite, much like the universe, but they are not 100% sure about the universe.

   :2thumbsup:   :Lolabove:

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## paddyjoy

> They say that stupidity is infinite, much like the universe, but they are not 100% sure about the universe, you need another plumber, no matter how cheap that one is.
> regards inter

  Very funny ha ha, I suppose when you do the same job all the time you can become complacent.

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## intertd6

> Very funny ha ha, I suppose when you do the same job all the time you can become complacent.

  Complacent would mean you knew that what your were doing was risky & dangerous, some people are not bright enough to realise that what they are doing could be lethal to them & some innocent victim who happened to be near an idiot at the wrong time.
regards inter

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## wonderplumb

Dear oh dear! Your plumber sounds like a winner! As plum said the whole installation needs to be tested after any work, even just changing a bayonet fitting. 
soapy water in a spray bottle is the go.
In saying this, I have heard of people purging new large installations into a bucket of soapy water with a turbo torch at the ready. When you can light the individual bubbles you're ready to go.

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## paddyjoy

Not sure how he purged it, must have missed that bit. 
I'll take a meter reading the next time we are going away and see if anything significant leaks.

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## plum

> In saying this, I have heard of people purging new large installations into a bucket of soapy water with a turbo torch at the ready. When you can light the individual bubbles you're ready to go.

  This was the accepted method when purging large commercial fitting lines when I worked at the gas company, safety measures were in place though.

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## Outback1964

> I know enough to know that this is not the *right* thing to do but is it something pretty standard with gas fitting? or do I need to use a different plumber next time?

  The gas fitter should have pressure tested the installation (with air) at a test pressure in accordance with AS5601 to prove the basic soundness of the installation before re-introducing gas and purging the air out and reconnecting supply. He should then use a bubble test to check for tiny leaks (or alternatively a drop test using a manometer). A bubble tester uses a clear plastic u-tube filled with water, temporarily installed at the start of the installation, and any gas flow through the installation (because of a leak) will cause visible bubbles to move through the water. It's a cheap and easy test which is surprisingly sensitive. Finally, spraying the fitting with Snoop (effectively soapy water in a spray bottle) will pinpoint a leak as the escaping gas will cause the detergeant to foam up. 
The notion that a cigarette lighter will actually indicate anything is laughable as a tiny leak won't result in enough gas being present to cause ignition (too lean) and a large gas leak would be downright dangerous.

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## SabreOne

And people continue to do stupid things!!!!!  Home explosion leaves man seriously hurt Tweed-Byron News | goldcoast.com.au | Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

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## Nifty Nev

I can feel a Darwin award coming on.

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## plum

> The gas fitter should have pressure tested the installation (with air) at a test pressure in accordance with AS5601 to prove the basic soundness of the installation before re-introducing gas and purging the air out and reconnecting supply. He should then use a bubble test to check for tiny leaks (or alternatively a drop test using a manometer). A bubble tester uses a clear plastic u-tube filled with water, temporarily installed at the start of the installation, and any gas flow through the installation .

  Sorry Outback 1964, but a licensed gasfitter should not use a 'bubble tester', a manometer is the instrument that should be used.

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## Cure1973

> Sorry Outback 1964, but a licensed gasfitter should not use a 'bubble tester', a manometer is the instrument that should be used.

  Yep I'm pretty sure you are supposed to test the whole installation PRIOR to starting any work? This is indeed tested with a manometer using said gas supply. When satisfied that there are no leaks then work can commence ( gas off of course !)
Once complete and the new installation connected to appliances or capped off ( and cooled down) purge any air out of the line and retest at the gas meter as before. Hey presto! If you have a leak mild soapy solution brushed on around welds or fittings is good or leak detector spray. Of course you will know its leaking as the manometer will have dropped on the gauge ..
So to sum up that guy is a moron and more than likely not even gas registered... But hey I'm a pommie tradesman what do I know?!!! :Biggrin:

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## wonderplumb

New installations a suitable pressure gauge is used with the installation pumped up, I think it's to 7kPa or 1,5 times the operating pressure, which ever one is greater (correct me if I'm wrong)
Existing installations, either a guage OR a manometer OR a bubble leak detector is suitable. Once this is tested prior to any work being carried out and all is well, it's only the work you have done on that installation that needs to be tested, this is where the soapy water comes into play.

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## Oldsaltoz

Old saying that applies to working with Gas or electrickery.  One flash and your ash. 
Good luck.   :Smilie:

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## Outback1964

> And people continue to do stupid things!!!!!  Home explosion leaves man seriously hurt Tweed-Byron News | goldcoast.com.au | Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

  Likely to be LPG, given the location. I don't think there's natural gas there. Point is, LPG is heavier than air so doesn't dissipate as easily.

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## Outback1964

> Sorry Outback 1964, but a licensed gasfitter should not use a 'bubble tester', a manometer is the instrument that should be used.

  True enough, a drop test with a manometer is preferred as you don't need to open the pipework to use it. However, older regs may not have a suitable test point available. A bubble tester can be used anywhere and is quicker, by the way, hence why gas companies tend to use them on relights for area outages. 
Also, in the context of the original post, a cigarette lighter was being used so I suggested a bubble test as a minimum because the lighter culprit might be more likely to use something that doesn't require him to read an actual instrument.

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## TheHammer

This is by far the dumbest post I've read so far on the Renovate Forum. That guy is like a drunk driver. You can only hope that he kills himself and no innocent bystanders. The collateral damage could be huge.

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## plum

> True enough, a drop test with a manometer is preferred as you don't need to open the pipework to use it. However, older regs may not have a suitable test point available. A bubble tester can be used anywhere and is quicker, by the way, hence why gas companies tend to use them on relights for area outages. 
> Also, in the context of the original post, a cigarette lighter was being used so I suggested a bubble test as a minimum because the lighter culprit might be more likely to use something that doesn't require him to read an actual instrument.

  I still disagree with the bubble tester, they are not used in Vic. and you don't test a fitting line with a manometer through the regulator test point, reason being you are testing the fitting line, not the reg and meter.  
Procedure is, 1: test fitting line at meter position before any work is attempted. 3: If any leaks present, locate and repair. [if leak cannot be found check permissable leak chart] 4: engage in any alteration of fitting line or appliance installation or disconnection. 5: Retest fitting line. 6: Soap test meter connections and inlet. 7: Purge and re-light.

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## paddyjoy

It's frustrating when you try and do the right thing and then end up getting burnt, hopefully not literally...

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