# Forum Home Renovation General Odds & Sods  Retrofit insulation on weatherboard cottage

## Tris

Hi all, 
I live in an old heritage weatherboard cottage on the highway which has no insulation what so ever.  It's very noisy and drafty, so I am looking at ways to retro fit wall insulation for sound deadening mostly.  Was all set to go with foam injected - deposit paid and the men arrived to do the work, but he took one look at the internal wall boards and said it was a no go as they'd all warp.  Just devastated.  So back to plan A- remove the external boards (they look easier) and shove in bats.   
Hubby and I are novices, but keen- so any advice? There seem to be millions of bats, what's the best for heavy noise and a tight budget? 
thanks all - Tris

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## Moondog55

Probably the combination of rockwool and Tyvek and replacing the existing boards

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## Tris

Thanks for that- tyvek was new to me and the 2 together look like the way to go. 
what's the opinion on r3.1 Bradford sound screen batts.... Are they worth the extra $$? 
Any advice on the best way to remove weatherboard without breaking them...or is it just a case of be gentle with a crowbar and cross your fingers?

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## shauck

I'm curious to know what the installer thought of your internal linings. Are they in poor condition? Worse than the weatherboards? Using batts and tyvec / house wrap and fitting from the outside after removing weatherboards (good luck doing that without damage) will sort out your insulation/draft issues pretty much but not do that much for sound insulation from external noises as sound will get in through air gaps and vibration - windows, doors, roof, floor, etc. Unless you can fix all these issues too, you'll not get the best result. I'd be choosing insulation based on it's insulative performance rather than anything else.  
Ideally, I'd choose to remove weatherboards if they are in poor condition, replace them and paint. Replacing rather than rejuvinating can save you a lot of prep time when it comes to painting and you start with a blank canvas. No previous coatings failing underneath your new coating. All sorts of dramas can unfold when painting over old weatherboards. It takes a lot of time and mucking about to use old materials. Weatherboards aren't that expensive really, it's installation which will cost you unless you're prepared to do it yourself. At the end of it all, you have put all that effort in and it looks brand new.  
or 
I'd remove internal lining if in poor condition, replace and paint. Retrofitting house wrap in this situation is not as ideal as when you wrap the house from outside. There's a lot of cutting and and stapling to the frame and ideally taping as well. It's not hard to do but a bit time consuming and not as good a result as the external frame is not protected from moisture. Then of course there's plastering. Lots of fun. Lots of dust and mess. Probably a bit of framing prep, straightening, adding of studs, noggings, etc.  
Do some googling and you'll find lots of info about sound insulation. I looked at this site recently and although it's from USA, it is a good site for info.   Soundproofing Panels, Acoustic Tiles, & Services - Soundproofing by Netwell

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## Moondog55

Of course if you are willing to maximise the return you could always use the maximum thickness of Foilboard, 25mm, battens and new weatherboards but that means a lot of work on the windows as none of them will fit afterwards.
As Su says when you do this you have to pay attention to all gaps and use fillers and caulks and sealers everywhere there is even a tiny gap and when you finish with that the windows and other penetrations become the weak point.
If the building is heritage listed you may not be permitted to do anything that changes the external appearance.
My mate did a lot of research before he insulated his walls and Rockwool did seem to offer the best combination of R value coupled with STC

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## Tris

Don't know what happened to my last response, so forgive me if this posts twice. 
The internal boards are in great nick, the problem was that the foam had a high water content and the boards would've warped and buckled. 
I figured removing the exterior would be easier as the board are longer and fatter, and hoped they'd go back together like a jigsaw puzzle- is that incredibly naive? 
Appreciate that the littlest gap will let in the noise, but figured we'd stuff the batts in good and proper.  We've got magnetite on the front bedroom windows and we'll add them to the others, but it's impossible to know how much of a difference they make with all the noise coming through the walls.  As for the roof space, I'm thinking of an acoustic blanket over the existing batts and then Foam batts for under the floor boards.  Look the highway was here when I bought the place so I expect to live with road noise, but surely I can improve it.....or is this just a fools dream...but I got to try.

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## shauck

I really think you'll get all the answers about how to minimise sound if you go to that link and have a good read through the website. It will give you an idea of what you can do. It will be up to you how far you take it of course and if you leave out some of it, your result will be a partial success. As to how much, let us know how it turns out. Always good to hear follow ups.  
If it was me and I had the money, windows would be a big part of the solution, sealing all gaps, double wall lining (internal) and ceiling with sound deadening layer between.

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## johnc

Batts and foil board or Sisalation make a good start, good luck with getting the boards off as the others have said you may have to replace but if careful they can be removed. In the end if you insulate the walls, seal any gaps, block the vents, and increase the insulation in the ceiling you will reduce the noise a bit but it will still penetrate the window glass. You may want to consider either secondary, laminated or double glazing to reduce the noise as a final effort. It all comes down to cost, however for bang for buck caulking all gaps and insulate walls with a good foil will certainly make the house more liveable. Look for gaps around doors, windows, skirtings and wall vents to start with. Your timber lining itself also helps to reduce noise and you not trying to create a barrier so much as a baffle.

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## ozsurfer

We're part way through retrofitting R2.0 wall batts 90x430 into existing wall cavities.  Ours is a 50's weatherboard and our daughters bedroom regularly gets down to 14c overnight in winter.  I got quotes for the spray foam first and it was over 4.5k (our house is not that large). I spoke to an engineer who dealt specifically with insulation and his advice was get the boards off and do it yourself. I'm glad we did because the amount of little spaces and pockets created by random bits of timber through our structure the spray type would've missed loads i'm sure. Have no doubt it is time consuming but you get better as you go along.  Our boards have a lip the fits over the board below so it makes it difficult to hammer up with the chisel and start prising the board off without first damaging it.  I managed to do a whole day of it last week (covered about 16m2) and didn't lose a single board.  The first day I lost almost all of them.   The number of noggins through your wall structure will determine how many pockets there are and how many boards you need to take off.  We have at least 2 noggins creating 3 spaces between the studs from floor to ceiling (windows sometimes mean more). So that generally means taking 2 boards about 50 cm's up from the bottom then another 2 halfway up and then another 2 50cm's down from the top. Sometimes I find that 1 board is enough to shove the batts up or down the wall but it depends.  I watched a youtube clip that showed me exactly what to do.  Home Energy Retrofits Made Simple! - Walls - YouTube   Ultimately insulating all walls will cost about $350 in batts from bunnings and $200-300 in replacement boards, and of course a whole lot of time...  I'm hoping to complete all the bedrooms this weekend so will let you know the results in terms of heat retention and sound proofing.

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## Whitey66

One thing nobody mentioned regarding the sound is changing the front fence or planting shrubs,bushes or hedges.
These can make a big difference if your front yard is bare and have an open type fence.  
It won't help with your insulation of course,but it could help greatly with your noise issue.

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## Oldsaltoz

Make sure the weather boards are timber and not Asbestos before making any decisions. 
Good luck.   :Smilie:

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## Tris

Well inspired by ozsurfer's comments and progress we decided to remove a board and get an idea of what we're dealing with.  Pleased to say the board came off fairly easily (2 big screw drivers), sure we picked an easy one, but feeling fairly confident.  Now have the measurements of cavity width and depth.... And yes i's timber. 
then thought I should check out that sound proofing website recommended..... To learn that the timber framing is the culprit so batts probably won't make a huge difference to noise.  They suggest Db- block sheeting and strips to deaden the transmission in the frame.  Will vyteck do the same thing? And any suggestions on the strips?  Starting to see why thermal insulation is easy but acoustic insulation is referred to as "a dark art". 
We already have a solid wall along the front and paling fence down the side, high as allowed, but house is on piers so most of windows up is exposed.  Plant tall screening plants and I loose the sun.  
How'd you go ozsurfer? Give me hope.

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## johnc

The insulation will reduce the noise however your glazing may well be the biggest culprit I wouldn't assume the framing makes any efforts useless. Both the weatherboards and the timber lining help reduce noise as well.

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## shauck

> Well inspired by ozsurfer's comments and progress we decided to remove a board and get an idea of what we're dealing with.  Pleased to say the board came off fairly easily (2 big screw drivers), sure we picked an easy one, but feeling fairly confident.  Now have the measurements of cavity width and depth.... And yes i's timber. 
> then thought I should check out that sound proofing website recommended..... To learn that the timber framing is the culprit so batts probably won't make a huge difference to noise.  They suggest Db- block sheeting and strips to deaden the transmission in the frame.  Will vyteck do the same thing? No, Tyveck is sisalation. It's purpose is altogether different (deals with moisture and reflectivity of heat) And any suggestions on the strips?  Starting to see why thermal insulation is easy but acoustic insulation is referred to as "a dark art". 
> We already have a solid wall along the front and paling fence down the side, high as allowed, but house is on piers so most of windows up is exposed.  Plant tall screening plants and I loose the sun.  
> How'd you go ozsurfer? Give me hope.

  I know it's not what you want to hear but as you can see from that website, there's a lot to deal with. If it's really worth it to you, I think you'd be better off dealing with it from inside the house, replacing the wall linings with a system outlined in either that website or another AUS system of a similar nature. Then you can insulate at the same time. Also windows.  
If your weatherboards or some of them are due for replacement, bite the bullet and do them too. Take them all off and wrap the house with tyveck or rhino wrap or other sisalation. As an example, I replaced all my weatherboards and some repair to frame, replaced all architraves to doors and windows and some eaves and fascia. Took about a week (one person). Also about another week to paint everything, including windows and doors. Cost a couple of thousand in materials. My house is tiny (45sqm) so you can do the sums for cost. Maybe add a bit because I get a trade discount on materials (but live where materials are expensive in the first place). Maybe cheaper if you can find supplier cheaper than I can.  
If your not doing weatherboards, you'll need to fit sisalation from the inside which is not ideal as it doesn't cover the outer face of the stud, stapling it into all the sections of frame, before insulating.  
If you are doing both, sisalation from outside so you cover the studs completely, get the weatherboards back up and then do the insulation from the inside.

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## ozsurfer

> Well inspired by ozsurfer's comments and progress we decided to remove a board and get an idea of what we're dealing with.  Pleased to say the board came off fairly easily (2 big screw drivers), sure we picked an easy one, but feeling fairly confident.  Now have the measurements of cavity width and depth.... And yes i's timber. 
> then thought I should check out that sound proofing website recommended..... To learn that the timber framing is the culprit so batts probably won't make a huge difference to noise.  They suggest Db- block sheeting and strips to deaden the transmission in the frame.  Will vyteck do the same thing? And any suggestions on the strips?  Starting to see why thermal insulation is easy but acoustic insulation is referred to as "a dark art". 
> We already have a solid wall along the front and paling fence down the side, high as allowed, but house is on piers so most of windows up is exposed.  Plant tall screening plants and I loose the sun.  
> How'd you go ozsurfer? Give me hope.

  Bedrooms were completed this weekend just gone and am well pleased with the results.  Bedrooms are really holding the warmth from the heating much better.  Not sure about the sound proofing effect though.  We have quite large windows which although well sealed seems to be where any noise is coming through and probably now where any heat is escaping.
A worthwhile exercise and overall we're very happy.  We didn't even contemplate the slightly more expensive acoustic batts just because noise is not really an issue for us.  Any noise reduction is just an added bonus. 
The main driver for us was reducing condensation and eliminating mould in cold bedrooms. 
These kind of projects when you start looking into them seem to get very complicated very quickly.  My approach is to do what you can within reason and cost.  If you can remove all the boards then yes this is probably the best option and Im sure acoustic batts would make a noticeable difference although Im no expert.  Removing all boards was not an option for me, 2 small kids and little time but still very happy with the results.

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## johnc

> Bedrooms were completed this weekend just gone and am well pleased with the results.  Bedrooms are really holding the warmth from the heating much better.  Not sure about the sound proofing effect though.  We have quite large windows which although well sealed seems to be where any noise is coming through and probably now where any heat is escaping.
> A worthwhile exercise and overall we're very happy.  We didn't even contemplate the slightly more expensive acoustic batts just because noise is not really an issue for us.  Any noise reduction is just an added bonus. 
> The main driver for us was reducing condensation and eliminating mould in cold bedrooms. 
> These kind of projects when you start looking into them seem to get very complicated very quickly.  My approach is to do what you can within reason and cost.  If you can remove all the boards then yes this is probably the best option and Im sure acoustic batts would make a noticeable difference although Im no expert.  Removing all boards was not an option for me, 2 small kids and little time but still very happy with the results.

                       Heavy curtains with pelmets are very effective in dealing with heat loss if you haven't already got them.

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## barney118

try this: Proactive Technology Australia Pty Ltd - Creators of Polastic Insulation System - Home

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## Micky77

Hi Tris 
I am in the same boat as you and was keen to hear how you got on? 
Many thanks,

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