# Forum Home Renovation Kitchens  New budget galley kitchen 3700x2500

## andrewkafp

Just found this site, as we have bought 16 yo home with a "tired" kitchen and are replacing it.
Thought I might share any positives and negatives with anyone interested.
Will post some pics soon. 
1st step. Remove old Kitchen inc stove, hotplate fan , dishwasher and sink..Could have kept some parts, but the dishwasher was old tech as was the rest. It is now landfill at the Helensvale tip where it belongs.  :Redface: )  
All removal was done by me. Just had to get a sparky and plumber to disconnect services (didn't really HAVE to.. just wanted to keep it legal).
What I learned is.. I saved a lot of  money, They weigh a lot, and when removing wall tiles, be prepared to take some "wall" out too. I am glad the original installer did not use liquid nails to stick the wall cabs the wall (there is a god) 
2nd step, draw up proposed kitchens to suit the boss's needs and fit in the area at a good price.
I got a local kitchen maker to give us a quote (no appliances) It was about $9,000 designed and installed with basic laminated tops and plain doors.Custom made, but flat pack (us to install) was about $7800 and a "Bunnings" type standard flat pack $6800. 
These prices are very good and I did consider going with them.
I then drew up plans in Bunnings, Mitre10 and Ikea simulators, to cut a long story short, Ikea had the lowest prices (in general) had nice solid beech doors on special for half price and had a better range of worktop colours so we went with them.
All up cost with a new wall oven, cooktop, concealed rangehood,large sink, mixer and $900 Bosch dishwasher. $6500. 
TBC

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## andrewkafp

Luckily, there were tiles in the shed that were left over from the house built ib 1992. As this was the original kitchen, it was built on the slab. So when removed, I re-tiled all the low parts back to one level. This gave me and option to now change the layout and not re-tile the whole kitchen/family room. :2thumbsup:  
I have ordered the custom made worktops from Ikea (Laminex ltd) and sourced all of the solid ADEL beech doors and drawer fronts. As they are not veneer, I can plane them back if the last wall cabinet is too tight (looks OK on paper). 
Next step, while waiting for the tops, is to start putting together some of these cabinets and lining them up using the standard Bunnings, ikea type instructions.
Make sure you measure and check all of your specs before ordering custom made tops or you may end up having to order another set.Particularly what edges are raw, laminated or double sided. The store can help, but DONT rely them. 
I found all of the wall studs and marked out the positions of the wall cabinets on the wall in pencil. At this stage you can move your power points to the right location. Best to use a qualified person, even though it is a simple job.  Double power points don't cost any more and use standard A N E wires, so get the sparky to put these in if you use kettle, bread maker, toaster etc. 
TBC

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## zeeeb

jee that is CHEAP!!! i've had a heap of quotes for my galley kitchen (it's a bit bigger 6.7m by 2.2m) so i have loads of cupboards. and my prices have ranged from $9000-$13000. I haven't been to IKEA, because i hate the joint, but maybe i should.

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## andrewkafp

You don't have to go to Ikea. Bunnings and Mitre10 are also competitive and have similar kitchens. We just chose Ikea because of workbench variety and they had adel solid doors at 1/2 price.
You can log on to any of these sites and draw up you plan, saving your plan to their site. It will calculate everything for you, and you can bring it up any time to edit.

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## arms

[ We just chose Ikea because of workbench variety and they had adel solid doors at 1/2 price. 
sorry but thats not entirely true and i quote from the site  
product description & measurements
Door:
Basematerial: Solid beech, Clear acrylic lacquer
Door panel: Particleboard, Beech veneer, Clear acrylic lacquer 
Base cabinet frame:
Frame: Particleboard, Polypropylene plastic, Melamine foil
Back: Fibreboard, Acrylic paint 
Shelf:
Particleboard, Melamine foil, Polypropylene plastic

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## andrewkafp

Product Information - Also from the site 
Key features Frame of solid beech, a hardwearing natural material. The door can be mounted to open from the left or right. 
The door frame is solid (about 90mm all around) The centre panel is some sort of decorative ply. (which is on a part of the door never touched) They have a Dovetail joint joining the four edges.
The benefit they have is that they can be planed back if the cabinets are too tight or the wall is not straight and not exposing chipboard or compromising the vaccum laminated coating. They are the same price as a plain white "foil" door.I suppose there is no other advantage and I would have been happy to go with "foil" if they too were discounted. Saved over $1000 on the door and drawer front (28 pieces) 
BTW I would certainly have given kitcheninabox a go if we lived closer to Ipswich. The website is informative and leaves most others for dead.  http://www.ikea.com/PIAimages/81996_PE207272_S4.JPG

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## arms

> Product Information - Also from the site 
> Key features Frame of solid beech, a hardwearing natural material. The door can be mounted to open from the left or right. 
> The door frame is solid (about 90mm all around) The centre panel is some sort of decorative ply. (which is on a part of the door never touched) They have a Dovetail joint joining the four edges.
> The benefit they have is that they can be planed back if the cabinets are too tight or the wall is not straight and not exposing chipboard or compromising the vaccum laminated coating. They are the same price as a plain white "foil" door.I suppose there is no other advantage and I would have been happy to go with "foil" if they too were discounted. Saved over $1000 on the door and drawer front (28 pieces)  
> BTW I would certainly have given kitcheninabox a go if we lived closer to Ipswich. The website is informative and leaves most others for dead.  http://www.ikea.com/PIAimages/81996_PE207272_S4.JPG

  now your key point is that you can plane back the doors if they dont fit ,and heres where the difference is ,we,as flatpack kitchen manufacturers make the cabinets to the clients sizes to fit their project not as most imported resellers say 'heres our product now you go and make it fit".we sell kitchens and transport them all over australia ,we have just sent a kitchen and wardrobe set to whyndam western australia (in between broome and darwin) and the customers are delighted because everything fitted . i would drive past helensvale every 2nd day through my business dealings on the coast . i sell more kitchens in wodonga nsw through a dealer there than i do in ipswich (funny that).
But thanks for looking at my site ,i have tried to put as much information into it as possible to help the diy market,maybe next time hey? :Biggrin:

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## andrewkafp

"now your key point is that you can plane back the doors if they dont fit "
There is a little bit more to it. I have read on this site that vaccuum laminated doors can delaminate near stoves and sinks, but you really don't know how these kitchens have been treated by the owners/tenants. Also, I read that it is a good idea to seal any jigsaw cut-outs for Cooktop and sink to mimimise absorbsion of moisture.
I would also use silicone for both,a s they are not going to be removed in the near future. 
I have found 1 problem so far (Challenge... if you are an optimist  :Biggrin: )
The rangehood cabinet from Bunnings and Ikea when fitted with ANY slide out fan (the concealed type) does not allow for the bottom hinge. More specifically, it is 600mm wide (ext) take off 25mm for board thicknesses, you have 575mm left inside. All of these rangehoods are 550mm inside. This leaves 12.5 mm for a hinge.. the hinges are more like 20mm. If you go and look at the demo kitchens in both stores, the shifty buggers have moved the hinge up 100mm and filled the routed hole with a plastic cover... 
What will I do ?? hmm let me see.
One benefit of using kitcheninabox... You would say " Arms ..please custom make my fan cab to suit my whirpool rangehood.

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## arms

> "now your key point is that you can plane back the doors if they dont fit "
> There is a little bit more to it. I have read on this site that vaccuum laminated doors can delaminate near stoves and sinks, but you really don't know how these kitchens have been treated by the owners/tenants. Also, I read that it is a good idea to seal any jigsaw cut-outs for Cooktop and sink to mimimise absorbsion of moisture.
> I would also use silicone for both,a s they are not going to be removed in the near future. 
> I have found 1 problem so far (Challenge... if you are an optimist )
> The rangehood cabinet from Bunnings and Ikea when fitted with ANY slide out fan (the concealed type) does not allow for the bottom hinge. More specifically, it is 600mm wide (ext) take off 25mm for board thicknesses, you have 575mm left inside. All of these rangehoods are 550mm inside. This leaves 12.5 mm for a hinge.. the hinges are more like 20mm. If you go and look at the demo kitchens in both stores, the shifty buggers have moved the hinge up 100mm and filled the routed hole with a plastic cover... 
> What will I do ?? hmm let me see.
> One benefit of using kitcheninabox... You would say " Arms ..please custom make my fan cab to suit my whirpool rangehood.

  
thats a common shortfall for the imported kitchens ,they dont have retractable rangehoods ,what we do is take the overall size of the cabinet height then make the cabinet shorter by the length of the r/hood body ,then we lengthen the doors to cover the face of the hood ,you get the same problem when fitting underbench ovens and wall ovens ,the cabinet is built generically and not all appliances are generic ,so in your case you shoulld cut the height down and redrill the hinge to suit ,bet they fell over themselves to explain that solution to you  :Doh:

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## andrewkafp

Thanks for the advice. Not that easy though. The door has a pre-routed hole (about 25mm) at the top and bottom. The doors cannot be cut down that much as they have a frame.
Also, to re-drill the door hole with spade, it would right through. As it is only a fan cabinet, I will most likely have to do as Bunnings have done and re-route the door hole 100mm up and make a tidy plug for the hole.

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## arms

> Thanks for the advice. Not that easy though. The door has a pre-routed hole (about 25mm) at the top and bottom. The doors cannot be cut down that much as they have a frame.
> Also, to re-drill the door hole with spade, it would right through. As it is only a fan cabinet, I will most likely have to do as Bunnings have done and re-route the door hole 100mm up and make a tidy plug for the hole.

  but doesnt that mean that the r/hood would be below the bottom of any ajoining cabinets,also you can buy the 35mm bits at bunnys ,and tekform on the coast (labrador)can sell you some 35mm blanks for the holes ,now that i think about it they probably have the bit as well  :2thumbsup:

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## andrewkafp

Thanx m8 
The cabinet is designed to house the fan by moving the base up app 150mm so the doors close in thier normal position. The cabinet is short.. 580mm So the pull out section will be higher than the wall cabinet bottom. (700mm)
All I will do is to keep it the same, but raise the hinges up. I am a corrugated packaging designer (not much like wood), but have enough of a planning mindset to visualise how things will work (but sometimes they just don't :Confused: ) 
Unless my brain comes up with some marvellous wave in the next week or so, it will be just raise the hinges.

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## andrewkafp

Just finished installing the 2 1955x400 Pantries and the 800 sink cab on the other side (had to move a power point and a few taps). Ikea cabinets are a breeze to assemble and mount. (they are Perfectly made) A 5 year old could do it if they were just a bit taller. :Biggrin:  They have these hinges that friction fit in the doors. (no screws). You just insert and pull down a pivoting lock that makes the insert bite into the hole.Those Swedes...Don't ya just love em. You just have to watch the plastic legs that will smash if you lean them on an angle with weight . (they also have metal ones if you prefer them) . 
BEFORE PICTURES

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## andrewkafp

Some more.  http://yfrog.com/9ep7180015thjjx

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## rrobor

My preference as to kitchens was that if its custom sizes you are stuck with what you have, My one is Flatpax and though yes I had issues in the end if her indoors wants a new look we can get new doors or if the grandkids bike takes a chunk its not a huge disaster. As to tops, a woodie makes his own doesnt he.

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## andrewkafp

I would have had a go at everything myself except for the fact that I hear comments like. "Why don't you get a professional in to do it ?". And.. I don't want the kitchen looking like we did it ourselves".. etc.. After seeing a Villaworld home built for us a few years ago, some "Professionals" would be better suited to driving a cab. :Wink:

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## rrobor

There is no reason not to. My kitchen is home built an you can see bits on the  *Options to connect a gas stove* post. The benchtops are redgum cut from wet fence posts and seasoned for a year, the floor Bamboo laid by me. The electrics for the cooker is a pro job hitching the gas was a pro job that failed so was redone by me. The walls (yet to be tiled) are cement sheet. The sink plumbing was me and my Aldi blow torch, and guess what its as good as anything I could have bought for 3 times the price.

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## andrewkafp

Sounds pretty good to me . BTW.. Big fan of Aldi.. Our $1000 Medion laptop blows everything away (bang for buck) and has never missed a beat. Even the Nerd sites praise it.. Also I bought one of their $80 50w Electric guitar amps amd "hotted" it up a bit. Sounds as good as $600 Marshall... :Biggrin:  Or .. is that just my playing ??? :Cool:

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## andrewkafp

I have run into a small problem (which I identified at the begining). When you install a concealed fan into the fan cabinet. There is not enough room for the "blum" style bottom hinge. Refer photo. Arms had a solution (get another hole routed up higher) which is the best so far. But I only have 1 door (now permanently out of stock) and I am trying to investigate if I can use hinges that don't rely on the countersunk recess. I know that the standard type needs the recess to house the folded hinge, but maybe there is another type that doesn't without compromising the function of the door. :Confused:

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## arms

> I have run into a small problem (which I identified at the begining). When you install a concealed fan into the fan cabinet. There is not enough room for the "blum" style bottom hinge. Refer photo. Arms had a solution (get another hole routed up higher) which is the best so far. But I only have 1 door (now permanently out of stock) and I am trying to investigate if I can use hinges that don't rely on the countersunk recess. I know that the standard type needs the recess to house the folded hinge, but maybe there is another type that doesn't without compromising the function of the door.

  seems simple enough  http://www.nover.com.au/productinfo.asp?ID=620

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## andrewkafp

Arms... You are da man.. These look promising... thanx..
When we move to Bribie.. It will happen.. And we nned a new kitchen.. and you always do  :Mad:  You'll be 1st on my list. 
BTW Never need an excuse to drive up to the Sunsine coast.

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## andrewkafp

Put a pair of top hinges "Prestige" spring type for the fan cab.. They work well, even even the boss is happy (FIGJAM)  :2thumbsup: 
Assembled the oven cabinet.. We used a Chef basic Fan forced wall oven. Well lucky a fly didn't have his willy caught in there otherwise I wouldn't have got the oven in. It is as tight as a fishes bum.. I had to replace the screws on the bottom bracket (cabinet) with flush head types and had to remove 2 screws holding the stove base on (will replace them with flush type). The front top steel bracket (cabinet) will not fit as it is 560mm wide and the stove is 564 at the widest point. On the positive side, the bottom drawer fits well and once the stove is pushed in, the front fits perfectly under the bench top. Looks like I'll get to use my favorite power tool.. The mighty grinder... :Biggrin:  
photos coming

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## andrewkafp

Plumbing, stove, cooktop, Dishwasher installed. Electrician is comimg tommorrow  to hook up "wire in " appliances.
Those Ikea (Blum) drawers are sensational.. They fit together perfectly, and some of the design work is just pure showing off...     http://yfrog.com/7ep7260044jx

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## arms

> Plumbing, stove, cooktop, Dishwasher installed. Electrician is comimg tommorrow to hook up "wire in " appliances.
> Those Ikea (Blum) drawers are sensational.. They fit together perfectly, and some of the design work is just pure showing off...     http://yfrog.com/7ep7260044jx

  i will try not to sound like a smartarz here but you have cut your dishwasher pipes in the wrong place ,they should be cut down through the bottom and then through the side of the kickboard or panel beside the dishwasher ,your current setup will not allow the dishwasher to go hard against the back wall and will protrude out from the door face  :Doh:

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## andrewkafp

Thanks Arms. 
I am not an expert by any means. I put them there so that the tap and drain are uninterrupted. The Dishwasher  will only come out 10mm or so past the doors and will be short of the benchtop. There is a recess in the back to allow for the pipes and it looks OK. But I can still move them if need be. There was one embarassing moment. The damn thing would not work at first.. Said "check water" I checked it and there was water... But some idiot forgot to drill out the dishwasher hole on the drain pipe... It was telling me.. I cannot empty...So I will not fill... Notice the cooktop is off centre. This was done by choice to allow bench space and doesn't compromise the fan by any more than an few inches.
Have to put in a good word for Laminex. They did a great job on the Bench tops.Soare Laminex strips joining clamps and spot on job on the size. Bit nervous cutting out the hole, but it ended well.

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## cabmods

Ahhhha the joys of DIY flat pack kitchens. :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## andrewkafp

Sparkies came yesterday and hooked up the cooktop and wall oven. Cost $120 and was a simple matter of running existing cables to each unit.Didn't even want to give a a reciept until I persisted.. I have installed the cabs on the other side and then sink... pics to come

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## andrewkafp

Fitted the drawers to one of the 800mm cabs. The middle drawer was catching on the bottom one by 1 or 2mm. I had just finished calling IKEA all the obscene names I could think of (in my head of course) when another look at the paperwork showed some adjusting screws for not only up and down, but side to side and front to back of about 5mm.. Luckily the oven was hooked up so I could warm up the humble pie... :Blush7:  
You know what they say R.T.F.M   (read the manual)

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## andrewkafp

All done except for the tiling.

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## arms

> All done except for the tiling.

  andrew bite the bullet and recut your access points for the dishwasher ,you will be amazed how much better it will look being level with the door faces

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## andrewkafp

Arms 
I am going to leave it sticking out just to annoy YOU....  :Biggrin:  
My mrs said the same thing, so I just put the knee into it and it went right back. I had it sticking out because I was still messing with the plumbing... (dishwasher that is) This model has a top legde at the back and a good 80mm cavity all the way down. the tubes fit in there. But you have a good eye.. (spose it's a necessity in your line of work) 
It is a Bosch SMS50E12AU The manual is on the site, but the rear view is only a sketch

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## arms

> Arms 
> I am going to leave it sticking out just to annoy YOU....  
> My mrs said the same thing, so I just put the knee into it and it went right back. I had it sticking out because I was still messing with the plumbing... (dishwasher that is) This model has a top legde at the back and a good 80mm cavity all the way down. the tubes fit in there. But you have a good eye.. (spose it's a necessity in your line of work) 
> It is a Bosch SMS50E12AU The manual is on the site, but the rear view is only a sketch

  can,t annoy me ,my kids have tried and given up for lack of emotion ,so that worked ,the knee does worry me though  :Yikes2:

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## chromis

> jee that is CHEAP!!! i've had a heap of quotes for my galley kitchen (it's a bit bigger 6.7m by 2.2m) so i have loads of cupboards. and my prices have ranged from $9000-$13000. I haven't been to IKEA, because i hate the joint, but maybe i should.

  
I priced a galley kicthen (timber) at Ikea (no bench top) for $4,500 and then got a cabinet maker to price up the same but with solid American Cherry doors (veneer cherry sides)  no handles and that was 4,300 installed. He also did a MDF bench tops which I got wrapped with stainless steel and I think the handles were about 300 bucks.  
The guy did a beautiful job and I think it looks 10X better than Ikea. So maybe shop around.  
I didnt get all the trimmings like those self close doors blah blah and I think that actually saved me heaps of money. Seriously how hard is it to close a draw or cupboard without slamming it.  :Biggrin:  I think all that gear is a bit of a money trap. I went for stylish and simple and spent the money where I thought it counted which isnt hidden inside a cupboard.  
The advantage I thought was I got to design the kicthen to suit and have exrta large pull out draws for storage etc in really nice timber and fully installed.

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## andrewkafp

Soft closing doors/drawers cost about $10 per door (that is 1x2 pack of soft close hinge attachments). The major cost is the door/drawer and end/side panels.
You must have forund the cheapest kitchen bloke in the country, because there is nobody around her that can match flat pack prices with a "supply and install" price.
You have at least 1 day labour  for 2 people which would have to be $1000 at least.

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## andrewkafp

More pics with dishwasher moved back...  to make Arms feel a bit more warm and fuzzy..
Tiles are from Bunnings..  Small ones are  bit pricey $67 sqm and the big ones are $29 sqm. Powerpoint cut outs were done very slowly using a hand tile cutting saw..
But they still stayed in 1 piece. Found tile shops to be very very expensive (a bit like kitchen shops)  http://yfrog.com/5kp8120020jx

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## arms

[quote=andrewkafp;768781]Soft closing doors/drawers cost about $10 per door (that is 1x2 pack of soft close hinge attachments).   
adding these to doors/drawers do not constitute being able to call them soft closing 
they are called dampners and the hardware is the same as normal

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## piscean

> I priced a galley kicthen (timber) at Ikea (no bench top) for $4,500 and then got a cabinet maker to price up the same but with solid American Cherry doors (veneer cherry sides)  no handles and that was 4,300 installed.

  
can I ask who your cabinet maker was chromis?

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## andrewkafp

A bit of tiling

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## Alastair

[quote=arms;769281]  

> Soft closing doors/drawers cost about $10 per door (that is 1x2 pack of soft close hinge attachments).   
> adding these to doors/drawers do not constitute being able to call them soft closing 
> they are called dampners and the hardware is the same as normal

  G'day Arms, 
 Looking over some kitchens for ideas, I noticed some which employed a piston type of damper, installed into the bottom shelf of the cabinet, which in conjunction with standard hinges, gave a "soft closing" function.
I was wondering as the "go-to" bloke for info, if you had a source for these? 
many thanks

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## arms

[quote=Alastair;769455]  

> G'day Arms, 
> Looking over some kitchens for ideas, I noticed some which employed a piston type of damper, installed into the bottom shelf of the cabinet, which in conjunction with standard hinges, gave a "soft closing" function.
> I was wondering as the "go-to" bloke for info, if you had a source for these? 
> many thanks

  http://www.nover.com.au/products.asp?ID=78

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## andrewkafp

The Ikea ones look like this.
$10 per pair... left = doors right = drawers
"
Product Information
Key features Catches the running drawer so that it closes slowly, silently and softly. 
Product Information
Key features To be mounted on INTEGRAL hinges with 125° opening angle; catch the moving door so that it closes slowly, silently and gently.

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## Alastair

[quote=arms;769477]  

> http://www.nover.com.au/products.asp?ID=78

  
As always Tom, 
Thanks heaps. 
regards

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## arms

[quote=Alastair;769613]  

> As always Tom, 
> Thanks heaps. 
> regards

  my pleasure  :Happyb:

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## chromis

> Soft closing doors/drawers cost about $10 per door (that is 1x2 pack of soft close hinge attachments). The major cost is the door/drawer and end/side panels.
> You must have forund the cheapest kitchen bloke in the country, because there is nobody around her that can match flat pack prices with a "supply and install" price.
> You have at least 1 day labour  for 2 people which would have to be $1000 at least.

  
Your kitchen does look a lot more complicated than mine, so perhaps that is why mine was cheaper. His wife also helped him so cheap labour maybe  :Smilie:

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