# Forum Contacts & Links Timber, Tools & Hardware Suppliers  Bunnings vs. Masters vs. Home Hardware vs. Others?

## travelislife

Okay, so a few questions regarding the sourcing of construction materials. I am about to undertake a major house renovation doing a lot of the work myself and trying to make my dollars go as far as possible. Looking at probably around 130k in material costs. I have Bunnings, Masters and Home Timber and Hardware nearby. I will be approaching them each to see if they can offer me trade pricing (not sure what kind of discount this might be off their list pricing?) or anything along those lines, though I don't have an ABN so not sure how this works.  Alternatively my questions/statements below, please correct me if I am wrong or you believe there is a better way to get a discount:  *Woolworths Group* 1. If I purchase Woolworths WISH cards (5% through Entertainment Book) I can then use these at Masters, correct? 2. Masters has intermittently also been running promotions with 15% Gift Cards back per $100 spend. 3. Thus if I can wrangle it and get my timing right spend $1000 actual cost is only $800. Though they do exclude 'trade quantities' but haven't seen a definition of that so might have to split the sales up. 4. Otherwise they also offer to beat a cheaper price by 10% so will do some investigating there. 5. Masters is struggling for business so am more than happy to cash in on any promotions they are running!  *Wesfarmers Group* 1. What are my options for getting a discount on Coles vouchers? 2. Could I then use these vouchers to buy Bunnings vouchers instore? 3. Any other ways to get discounts on Bunnings vouchers? 
Alternates? Where would people recommend? It will include all framing timber, gyprock, doors, door fittings, etc.

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## SilentButDeadly

Personally...I'd ignore most of the bigger fools in the market and go straight for the professional specialist trade suppliers.  You get a better standard of advice if nothing else plus you develop relationships with specific people which helps in the long run.  It may not always be the cheapest option but it can be the smoothest...

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## johnc

> Personally...I'd ignore most of the bigger fools in the market and go straight for the professional specialist trade suppliers.  You get a better standard of advice if nothing else plus you develop relationships with specific people which helps in the long run.  It may not always be the cheapest option but it can be the smoothest...

  Ditto, some small building suppliers can also be cheaper, especially if they have limited themselves to the basics, buying the right stuff though in the long run is cheaper than having to take back gear that has been bought under advice but turns out to be wrong. It is also not unusual to discover in the big stores that the youth that serves you will actually tell you what you are after isn't on the shelves rather than look for it.

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## CraigandKate

I agree with SBD, I am currently looking at something similar. For general hardware I am going to contact my local Mitre10 about a trade account or similar for the project but for the major building materials I will be purchasing them separately from specialist dealers or auctions like fowles.

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## Marc

There is no answer to your question travel ... If there was one, all the others would be broke.  
Bunnings and Masters exist because it is convenient to have most stuff under one roof, just like the supermarket. You know you are buying second quality at prime prices yet you go anyway because most of the time you have no choice, no time, or can not be bothered driving all over town.
I agree with both Silent and JohnC. If you have a choice, you are probably better served at your local landscape supplier, plumber supplies, Electrical wholesaler, tool specialist, timber yard,  Home and Hardware or Hudsons or even some country town Mitre ten.
You can ask for a trade card at Bunnings, fill the application and expect some 5% or so if they give it to you without an ABN. The rules change every so often and I have not bothered myself since the times of Harwarehouse's demise even when my daughter works at Bunnings. A visit to your biggest Bunnings store and a chat with the manager may give you some leverage, who knows.  
Shop around for the big items, and look for convenience for the rest. And if you need advise, clearly you will not find it at Bunnings nor Masters. The others are 50/50, and the trade suppliers will shoot straight most of the time.

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## NRB

I owner built a house not long ago and found that the local timber/hardware were a far better deal than the big shed groups,not only were they competive and gave great advice but exchanged stuff when I made mistakes.
if you go along and get some quotes you may find that you can do better.
They delivered for a low cost and sometimes for free if other orders were to the same area.
My job lasted some time and I got sick and couldn't get to my house,I was able to get an account set up so my chippy could continue without me.
An example of how well it worked for me was buying cement in bulk( 2 ton lot good price) then having my bricklayer to pick up as he needed,no worries about storing bags on site,keeping them dry etc.
Smaller operator a big tick for me and good for them as I spent around $150000 with them.

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## travelislife

Thanks for the tips guys, I thought that might be the general gist. I will have to have a bit of a look around the local area and see what kind of suppliers are about.

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## notvery

Can we just start a slag off bunnies and masters thread??? please.... 
ok so if it helps... i just got quotes for 3.6m3 of concrete (in sand / cement / agggregate form) and cement / sand  for 1000~ bricks. didnt go to the green / blue shed as they are scum. 
my local home hardware quoted 1200 delivered and in bulka bags. the local sand/cement/agg etc supplier that ONLY does that stuff came in 100 ish lower. the thing i liked more was... while the hme hardware lot are really helpful and cant say enough good about them the specialists were very quick to correct my maths for qtys of things e.g i was a fair bit out on the m3 to weight conversion for the aggregate they picked up on that without prompting.
I would now go with them even if they were a bit more exe than another lot on the basis that im probably going to get what i want rather than what I think i want. of course i could screw up the initial maths and end up with several times the requirements but rubbish in rubbish out. 
now i just need to find a specialist cement mixer store.sigh 
oh and also bunnies and masters are scum in case i hadnt mentioned that before

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## David.Elliott

The other plus I experienced is from a timber supplier was I always, always, got better and straighter timber with much less effort...
I remember having to sort through 30ish 5.2s 90 x 45 in TP from the rack to get 7 worth having...so although I saved the client a coupla bucks on the timber the client paid me a lot more for the sorting... 
When I had timber delivered by a timber supplier, I could trust it was all worth having... 
Never buy power tools from the big sheds...it only encourages them... 
My favourite Mitre 10 here in Kelmscott, which had the biggest building supply shed I've ever seen, gave great service, always had what I needed, and would deliver free if I was not to bothered when, just packed it in...
Metcash bought it back from the owners who gave it to the son to run who made a bit of a hash of it. Now gone!

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## notvery

> Never buy power tools from the big sheds...it only encourages them...

   bwahahahahahahaa

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## OBBob

Agree the general gist above. I owner built and at the time you could apply for a Bunnings OB card (not sure it still exists) ... but the discount varied per item and you didn't know until they scanned it (averaged 5-10%). I ordered most of my materials from specialist trade yards.  
One thing that worked well was that I came up with a bill of materials, got a price for the whole lot and then the yard delivered in three separate batches at the appropriate stage of the build. Saves tripping over materials and not being able to store them correctly.  
By the way... even if you order the bulk of your materials elsewhere I'll bet you'll still end up giving Bunnings a fair bit of cash for all the bits in between that you 'forgot'.   :Biggrin:

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## phild01

Have to agree and when the supplier is familiar with you, they tend to offer discounting if you ask.  Bunnings is great when you are still doing something out of hours or need to prepare material the night before for making a more productive following day.  I like buying plasterboard from H&G as their delivery is free and convenient, Bunnings lose out here even if a bit cheaper.  I think delivery convenience is worth a lot.

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## METRIX

Unfortunately you will still spend up at Bunnings, even if you have no intention, because they are open at times you will need something, and they are everywhere. 
For example, this morning I dropped in at the huge one on Windsor road at 6:05, it was all lit up and open, meanwhile the Masters which was 200m away was all shut and deserted, they really need to look at things like this as to why they are not making money.  
One thing I will give Bunnings is their return policy is 2nd to none, they will take it back no questions asked, loose the receipt they will still take it back and give you a store credit, not many retail outlets will do that, if your with a specialist outlet, you can return anything as its all on your account. 
One problem with Bunnings is they stock a lot of low quality items, of which you would not use in your own place, or someone elses if you are charging them. 
If you want to buy timber you should be able to strike up a deal with a local specialist supplier, but I know in Sydney this does not work, as they have high rotation of staff, its easier opening an account with them will ensure you better discounts, you will require an ABN for this. 
Burnings have a Powerpass system for discounts, you will also need an ABN to open one of these, don;t know if they still do the owner builder thing. 
When your doing any building, it is usually a case of we need it quickly, and you won't have time to shop around, so you need to do your homework prior, so you know which outlet to buy what from. 
For example, if you walked into North Shore TImber and wanted to buy 50 sticks of T2 90x45, they will charge you more than you can get it from Bunnings, because you don;t have an account with them, and they dont really care about 50 sticks, as they sell around 2000 a week to builders. 
So for this Buninngs may be the better choice, plus you can hand pick what you want, if you have the time, and take back what you don't use.

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## plum

> Thanks for the tips guys, I thought that might be the general gist. I will have to have a bit of a look around the local area and see what kind of suppliers are about.

  What area are you? May be able to lead you to some suppliers.

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## DEMAK Timber

> The other plus I experienced is from a timber supplier was I always, always, got better and straighter timber with much less effort...
> I remember having to sort through 30ish 5.2s 90 x 45 in TP from the rack to get 7 worth having...so although I saved the client a coupla bucks on the timber the client paid me a lot more for the sorting... 
> When I had timber delivered by a timber supplier, I could trust it was all worth having... 
> Never buy power tools from the big sheds...it only encourages them...

  While we're all on the big box bashing...  Why you should buy your decking from us... - Demak - Your Outdoor Timber Specialists

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## travelislife

> What area are you? May be able to lead you to some suppliers.

  Thanks for all the info guys, very much appreciated. Yep that's the thing, a one off build is really small stuff for most players so I was expecting them to not really be interested but will wait any see. 
Will happily take any recommendation to follow up on. We are in the inner west of Melbourne. So Maribyrnong/Footscray/Seddon/Yarraville are probably the best bets or nearby suburbs. Delivery services would be a plus for sure.

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## OBBob

As much as I am tired of Bunnings, it's a necessary evil. Delighted to find there is a 'city' store (as opposed to a warehouse) now open in Collingwood (Victoria Pde.). Good for those last minute things at lunchtime or on the way home (for us pen pushing desk jockeys  :Rofl5: .

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## JB1

Also ask your Carpenter, who they like to buy from and compare the prices. 
Sometimes it's good if the store
has a relationship so your Carpenter can pick up one off items for you, returns etc. They also generally won't stuff the order up. 
I also got trade discounts using my Carpenters preferred store (Bayswater Mitre 10).

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## Marc

I remember a flooring job I did in a country house, the guys rang me and told me if I wanted them to pick up something from the shops for me. I told them to buy bread and milk ...  :Smilie:

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## DEMAK Timber

> We are in the inner west of Melbourne. So Maribyrnong/Footscray/Seddon/Yarraville are probably the best bets or nearby suburbs. Delivery services would be a plus for sure.

  We charge $66.00 delivery to that area. Cheers.

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## METRIX

> While we're all on the big box bashing...  Why you should buy your decking from us... - Demak - Your Outdoor Timber Specialists

  Actually some Bunnings  are picking their act up, went to Mcgraths Hill, and their Merbau is all divided up into sizes and stacked nicely, maybe they are learning.

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## OBBob

> Actually some Bunnings  are picking their act up, went to Mcgraths Hill, and their Merbau is all divided up into sizes and stacked nicely, maybe they are learning.

  I'm sure many start off like that... then the rummaging begins and there's no one maintaining it.

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## METRIX

> I'm sure many start off like that... then the rummaging begins and there's no one maintaining it.

  This one is different as they have assigned a few shelves to it, and it's sorted via size, most others have one big shelf and it just end up in a big mess.
Admittedly this is a BIG Bunnings store, you won;t see this happening at Thornleigh, they hardly have enough room for 5 pieces of Merbau.

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## OBBob

> This one is different as they have assigned a few shelves to it, and it's sorted via size, most others have one big shelf and it just end up in a big mess.
> Admittedly this is a BIG Bunnings store, you won;t see this happening at Thornleigh, they hardly have enough room for 5 pieces of Merbau.

  Well I've also noticed that they have been making a concerted effort at customer service,  which I put down to the competing from Masters who are much better in this regard. Bunnings face an uphill battle because their staff have been around a while and are entrenched in the old ways.

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## METRIX

> Well I've also noticed that they have been making a concerted effort at customer service,  which I put down to the competing from Masters who are much better in this regard. Bunnings face an uphill battle because their staff have been around a while and are entrenched in the old ways.

  Really ?, Where ?? HA HA HA HA HA

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## OBBob

> Really ?, Where ?? HA HA HA HA HA

  It's a staged roll out... I hear that NSW is last on the list as the demographic is deemed extra challenging!  :Tongue:

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## METRIX

This Roll out, what did YOU notice what the difference was, did the person actually know something ?

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## OBBob

> This Roll out, what did YOU notice what the difference was, did the person actually know something ?

  No... but in fairness I gave up asking them questions a long time ago. The difference I've noticed is the staff actually noticing the customers and in many cases evengreeting them!

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## METRIX

> No... but in fairness I gave up asking them questions a long time ago. The difference I've noticed is the staff actually noticing the customers and in many cases evengreeting them!

  WOW, that's something they really need to introduce here,

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## Marc

The problem at Bunnings is not customer service, if anything I find them trying too hard to please. I don't need that at a hardware store. May be in a hotel when on holidays. What most need is knowledgable stuff and that is where the problem lays. They can not find people with the know how nor can they train them past the general knowledge.
if you are a retiring tradesman, you are almost guaranteed to find employment at Bunnings.

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## OBBob

Yeah,  that's not going to change any time soon. Not only do they need retired tradies,  they need retired tradies with oodles of patience!

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## Micky013

I love the fact they don't ask if you need help. Recently went to a local mitre 10 and it's like they were stalking me - was kinda annoying. If I need help to find something I'll ask.

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## phild01

> No... but in fairness I gave up asking them questions a long time ago. The difference I've noticed is the staff actually noticing the customers and in many cases evengreeting them!

  That's all I ever get in Bunnings, greetings all over the shop.

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## plum

To me Bunnings  is a necessary evil, being local to most of my jobs for small maintenance items. What infuriates me is this incessant welcoming of customers, which I choose to ignore and just keep walking without acknowledging them back. Call me rude, but I don't give a crap about their fake 'hello sir. How are you today?' 
I've even had one lady on the checkout, run off in tears, not sure what it was about, but geeze harden up. Last week one lady ripped open a cistern box to make sure I hadn't 'knocked anything off'. Not impressed, didn't say a word to her, but glared and remained silent during the transaction. 
One last thing which really pi5ses me off is this business of stamping your receipt upon leaving the store. I now make sure I make eye contact with these front of shop stampers whilst at the register paying, and then if challenged at the front, walk past and say, 'you saw me paying for these items'. Again, call me rude, but my time is precious and these people believe that they are very important, but in actual fact, they are not....

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## METRIX

That's if you can actually find someone, most isles are deserted. 
And come to mention it, I have a bone to pick with Dural store, they now close their HUGE trade yard early, so last week I dropped in there not long after 5.00pm, DOH trade yard closed bugger, I needed some 5.4 190x45 urgently for a job first thing. 
Went out to the trade yard, picked my pieces of 5.4, thought oh no, how am I going to get these through the shop, which I have said many times before ALL THAT CRAP IN THE ISLES., looked down the isles and could only choose two due to no turning room from the trade doors into the isles, chose the isle with the least amount of crap in it. 
Pushing the dodgy trolley which wanted to go wherever it wanted, the boxes of crap were getting closer and closer, until BANG I hit some pile of gap filler boxes which were stacked 4ft high, BOOM, they all went over like a stack of cards, there must have been 30 boxes of 6 pack gap filler that went everywhere, I was laughing so hard I had to push the trolley quicker to get away so as not to attract attention to the crime scene, HA HA HA HA. 
Anyway got to the end of the isle and turning circle on dodgy trolley was like a tank, it just did not want to turn out of the isle, bang hit the karcher pressure washers, reverse, bang hit the green baskets, forward, bang karcher washers, reverse, bang hit the red shelves, forward bang nearly knock over said karcher display, reverse green baskets caught under wheels, forward hit damp rid display, reverse bang knock some crap hanging on hooks off the shelf, forward bang AHHHHHHHH, finally freed the trolly from the isle, all the time all the bunnings workes just went about their normal nothingness, nobody offered to help. 
FInally got to the checkout, and questioned the lady, why is the trade yard closed, she said it's a pain, they have started to close it earlier and all I get is complaints from the Tradies they can't get anything through the store, MMMM just another Bunnings lack of thought for their customers.

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## Pulse

Metrix, I tried to slide a few sticks under the trade gate after trade hours, they stopped me quick, said it wouldn't look good on CCTV.  
Today I bought a few 3/8 nuts from bunnings, the 'team member' looked at the metric nuts and washers barcode sheet for a few seconds and told me they don't exist. I kindly turned the page for her. Seriously where do they get them!  
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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## METRIX

> Metrix, I tried to slide a few sticks under the trade gate after trade hours, they stopped me quick, said it wouldn't look good on CCTV.

  Oh dear, no that wouldn't look too good. 
I dread going to a Bunnings after 5.00pm if you get caught up at the job and need something big, as you know the trade yard is closed down quick smart, Castle Hill is the only one that keeps their yard open till 9.00pm

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## OBBob

Ha ... I'm starting to think our local Bunnings is actually better than some of these other stores! On a number of occasions they've opened the trade yard gate so that I can load my stuff ... and that's at seven or eight PM.   
The other morning I needed to hire a Handy Ute. They don't open until 7am and I was meeting someone in the city at 7.30am ... not enough time after you've filled out the forms and then tackled weekday traffic. So I got to Bunnings at 6.15am ... I thought at least maybe someone setting up for the day may let me start filling out the rental forms so I can leave right on 7am. Ha ha ... they were very helpful and let me take it at 6.30am!! I was shocked.   
The point about the fake hello's is not so much that it's good or bad, it was more that it has quite obviously increased recently (at my store), which suggests they're concerned about their competition (Masters is on the other side of the road). Competition is good, albeit maybe not always driving the results all consumers are after.

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## David.Elliott

Had a bit of fun last Saturday arvo at Bunnies Rockingham.
Was digging new power trench and of course hit the water pipe. (I have set a record at this...helping the boss on his farm I found the ONLY underground waterpipe in 66 acres)
In expectation of this happening I had bought some fixtures and pipe...but what I dug up had a T with a mix of copper and 20mm plastic pressure pipe. 
Shot down to the Bunnies, could not find the plastic pressure fittings, asked a staff member and she informed me that the "plumbing" section, (as "plumbing" was not under pressure and was only related to drainage) did not have them. They were in the retic section. I used the standard "Really?" and she was backed up by a nearby male staffie, that plumbing was indeed not under pressure.  My wife and I stifled a laugh out loud and just moved on...
Interestingly the plastic pressure pipe is in the plumbing section though, along with all the copper fittings etc.   
The hello's after the first 6 get a bit tiresome. I note no one ever asks what do you need, they just say hello, whilst accelerating past... 
The new M that opened up near enough to us a long time ago, when it opened, was staffed by just that, retired tradies. That was great. I met a plumber, tiler, both finishing and framing chippies. Great advice.
I did end up with a Californian, as a kinda personal shopper who was an ex main contractor, named Murray.
Every time I went there I went straight to where he hung out. He grabbed a trolley and we walked the shop together with my list. He did know the shop well, so he'd glance at the list and we'd walk from one end to the other in order. Job Done. 
I had an experience like yours Metrix. Same Bunnies, had to get 22  x 5.4s of TP 90 x 45 at the last minute. Apart from spending a long time finding the best of the bad lot, getting them to the counter was fun and they refused to open the trade gates for me.

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## UseByDate

Can anyone understand this logic. About three years ago I could not drive a car due to medical reasons and needed to go Bunnings by train. The store has a front entrance and a rear trade entrance for vehicles. Walking from the train station, the closest entrance to the store was the trade yard. I walked through the trade yard and was about to enter the rest of the store. A Bunnings store employee stopped me and refused me entry. I asked why and he replied that since I did not have a car I would have to walk around to the front of the store to gain entry. No argument by me could convince him to let me in. I can understand not letting me leave the store via the trade yard if I did not have a vehicle, but why restrict entrance? By the way once you enter the store by the front pedestrian entrance there is nothing to stop you walking through the store to the trade yard and ending up in the same place I was stopped entering the store. To use an Americanism “go figure”.

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## DEMAK Timber

www.facebook.com/DemakTimber/posts/956606557724246  *Facebook fame for heartwarming Bunnings worker Nathan Steer*

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## pharmaboy2

Do a bit of quantity work and get quotes from local specialists.  My typical timber prices was 25% off the best my carpenter could get, frequently 40% lower than Bunnings et al on non std items ( eg Bunnings will be good for 90/45 TP and sleepers, but won't be good for 200/45 tp) 
quotes were asked for for all orders , but usually an order was between $5k and $10k.  After the first couple, I was saying yes over the phone or by reply email, no competitive quotes were necessary.

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## joynz

At Mentone in Melbourne, you can be loading a pallet of cement with no one offering to help.  They don't say hello then! 
Just once at the Keysborough store,  a Bunnings worker in his sixties (with an injured hand) helped load 40 bags though.

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## phild01

> Do a bit of quantity work and get quotes from local specialists.  My typical timber prices was 25% off the best my carpenter could get, frequently 40% lower than Bunnings et al on non std items ( eg Bunnings will be good for 90/45 TP and sleepers, but won't be good for 200/45 tp) 
> quotes were asked for for all orders , but usually an order was between $5k and $10k.  After the first couple, I was saying yes over the phone or by reply email, no competitive quotes were necessary.

  I liked NHS you have there.

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## simopimo

Give me Masters any day. I have 2 Bunnings and 1 Masters within about 8km of my place. The Masters store is further away, but I always opt for them. Better store layout, easier to find stuff, much more helpful staff, and they stock some cool US brands that you can't normally get here, due to their relationship with Lowes. 
Not sure how much longer Woolies will keep propping them up though.

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## markslostmarble

Not sure what was said, I read some but not all posts.
Im a builder in Brisbane, I use Cannon Hill Bunnings daily.
If you develop a relationship with the trade desk, they will really look after you.
I receive alot of discounts, free deliveries, faster sourced goods, quickest quotes, they open tills to serve me too.
But I do spend approx $2500 to $4000 a week.

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## markslostmarble

I forgot I do source all my timber larger timber orders from Woodstock timbers in Slacks Creek. Better quality and price.
Bunnings have matched before, but quality they get dumped off, is shocking most weeks.
Masters  softwood has been better. But not really a trade store at Tingalpa.

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## METRIX

Just don't go to Maitland Bunnings, or you could get swallowed up by the sink hole under the store. 
Or China https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMBLTdVU4ow

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## CraigandKate

I just asked at the local Mitre 10 last week (Chelsea Heights) and filled out a trade form as a owner builder. Got my card in the mail today! Not sure on the discount yet but better than nothing  :Redface:

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## Steffen595

Demak has the cheapest Modwood decking.
Nuts and bolts, find a proper shop, they are way cheaper, especially when it comes to stainless.
Mitre10 trades has better timber than Bunnings. Or fish around with timber suppliers. Some don't let you select your timber, jut go somewhere else then. Dont worry about leaving the crap timber at the shop, volume builders will use it.
Lamcal has good timber, actually chepaer than others.
Powertools, homebrand hot air gun paintstripped the entire house and still running. Homebrand electric staple gun did the whole roof and subfloor with sarking, still running.The only thing I am worried about, the Ozito nail gun. The part at the front where the nails come ou is plastic, not metal.
Paint I got from paintright, really helpful people. Plus they actually give you advice. Paintbrushes from $2 shop, some are pretty neat. And tbh, any paintbrush gets bold after 100m^2. Also you will find some products in $2 shops which are identical to stuff in Bunnings. Wrenches, scrapers and the like.

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## Marc

It's a piti that it seems Masters is going to fail. I say a piti because the consumer never benefits from a monopoly.
Unfortunately Woolies used the same marketing bully tactics they use against the corner stores but Bunnings is no corner store. 
They would have benefited from a modest low key approach Aldi style, but no, they had to go and attempt the big take over with a hardware model that resembles a Big W on steroids.

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## phild01

Did my first Masters visit recently at Northmead.  Nicely laid out but with next to no customers.  Nothing wrong with the store inside and was surprised by the variety of appliances.  The tool section was a bit low key and limited.  But it is an alternative store for things unavailable at that other store.  The problem with this store was location.  Near a main road but virtually invisible.  Despite greater money being spent on presentation and parking facilities, the nearby Bunnings has more road presence and far more customers.  I guess some fresh out of school execs couldn't get their head around the need for position position position and in Sydney, hard to find.  Would be sad to see it go and be left with just one major.

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## pharmaboy2

It's no done deal that masters is going to fail.   Just because finance journos have a whine, doesn't mean anything.  Almost by definition anything a finance journo knows is after the fact or pure speculation - it's not like politics where leaks are a matter of courses - no leaks in finance (at least not to a journo) 
masters lacks critical mass IMO - they need to look for opportunity and go hard, not open up next door to a bunnies

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## notvery

Made my first masters trip yesterday. It was like bumrings but with brighter lighting. I was amazed that they had Panasonic power tools and no makita tools. They did have about 30 brands of power tools most unheard of. The de walt were hidden away...can only guess they don't make much margin there. I left and bought a makita skin and a noname bench grinder at total tools rounds the corner. ..felt dirty visiting masters...but i did buy some stuff to build a thing inside my wardrobe. Sigh. Did nearly buy a pitch fork there but the quality was rubbish so walked away. All the staff were 12 year old also. One kid asked me 4 times if i needed help. ....grrrrrrrr

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## METRIX

I hope Masters keep going, they just need to open more stores, especially in NSW, you cannot compete with Bunnings because they are on every corner, like McDonalds.
If you need something most times you only need to drive 5-10 minutes to find one, if you have to drive 30 minutes to a Masters it's simply not going to work. 
People are creatures of habit, they will go to what they know, once Masters open more stores things will stat to change, then they will compete with the Green Giant, it will just take time, they knew this, and they said they were in for the long run. 
One thing Bunnings will have to upgrade some of it's stores as there are some which are really looking like Rubbish, like Rockdale - What a dump this store is, Kirrawee another dump, Thornleigh is showing it age but still functions (just), but for the life of me they DON''T stock the basics, Carlingford another dump,

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## phild01

> One thing Bunnings will have to upgrade some of it's stores as there are some which are really looking like Rubbish, like Rockdale - What a dump this store is, Kirrawee another dump, Thornleigh is showing it age but still functions (just), but for the life of me they DON''T stock the basics, Carlingford another dump,

  I remember when BBC Carlingford, now Bunnings, first opened and it seemed such a big hardware store.  This was when Aylward and Kennedy in Parramatta was around and it became BBC, and then Bunnings.  Then BBC Hardware House Thornleigh opened, now Bunnings, Oh what joy that was!

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## METRIX

Same. I grew up in Sydney South, and Kirrawee was a massive store, Rockdale was great when new, now Rockdale is just crap, and Kirrawee seems so small.
I guess when you compare them to Castle Hill and Alexandria, they all look ordinary, Oh and Ashfield is also rubbish, with the worst carpark / drive through.

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## Marc

> I hope Masters keep going, they just need to open more stores, especially in NSW, you cannot compete with Bunnings because they are on every corner, like McDonalds.
> If you need something most times you only need to drive 5-10 minutes to find one, if you have to drive 30 minutes to a Masters it's simply not going to work. 
> People are creatures of habit, they will go to what they know, once Masters open more stores things will stat to change, then they will compete with the Green Giant, it will just take time, they knew this, and they said they were in for the long run. 
> One thing Bunnings will have to upgrade some of it's stores as there are some which are really looking like Rubbish, like Rockdale - What a dump this store is, Kirrawee another dump, Thornleigh is showing it age but still functions (just), but for the life of me they DON''T stock the basics, Carlingford another dump,

  I wish it was that simple Metrix.  Woolies probably thinks the same way and do so at their peril. Market presence is one thing, throwing billions at new stores that are deserted is another. 
Should have taken a leaf out of the way Aldi is taking market share out of them. They are not next to them, they are not as big, started with a very basic stock, hardly any service in fact no service at all, they almost throw the stuff at you ... yet people go back and they now have much more stock. Why? fancy uniforms? Music?  locations ... not really, just consistently low prices and clever marketing of one off products.
i know Bunnings Bonnyrigg is getting a make over. They are extending where the bus depot is and will build a big one.

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## Uncle Bob

I too hope that Masters keeps going. Hopefully it forces Bunnings to compete and helps keep the bastards honest (unlikely).

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## OBBob

I prefer Masters because it's brighter, quieter, cooler, etc.  but I usually end up at Bunnings because I know what they have.

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## OBBob

They've just done a big renovation on our local Masters... so I don't think closure is imminent. It now has a Cafe... although I can't think of a worse place to sit down for a coffee!

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## David.Elliott

BBC hardware...that takes me back.. 
The two we had here are now 1 Bunnings and the other is a Good Guys, Anaconda, Baby whatever multi store. 
Lived a few minutes away when doing the reno on my Melville property. I used to have set guys I'd see for help.
I remember we changed the pan in the one toilet there. We wanted cream, but they were $40.00 more than the white. 
Without a blink the guy peeled the label and swapped for the label off a white one and sent me on my way...
Always remember getting what I needed there and getting great help and advice... 
ahhhhh those were the days... 
Wait... was that my Dad talking....?

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## METRIX

> Market presence is one thing, throwing billions at new stores that are deserted is another.

  If they are deserted because the stores are in the wrong place, it's  well documented that Masters have had a major issue picking where to  place a store, they chose cheap unsuitable sites, even Bunnings CEO said  the same about them.
Bunnings plans their new stores years in advance buying strategic plots  for these, once Masters fix this problem I'm sure people will go there,  when I visited the Chullora store there was plenty of people in there. 
Masters have 10 stores in NSW !!! and 2 have not been opened yet, and  they are all in the middle of nowhere, except Rouse Hill which is semi  reasonable, that's pathetic, Bunnings have 83 stores, and these did not  come overnight, it has taken them 20 years to get to that size, plus  they bought BBC, and Mitre 10 stores and converted them to Bunnings  stores, Masters has had to start from scratch, so it is about Market  presence, like McDonalds, they are not about junk food, they are a  Realestate developer, they buy and build a store and it becomes a prime  site, this is why they are worth Billions, even Bunnings has a $9  Billion turnover of the $45 Billion home improvement Market in AU, that  still leaves a lot of $ billions for Master to capitalize on.    

> Should have taken a leaf out of the way Aldi is  taking market share out of them. They are not next to them, they are not  as big, started with a very basic stock, hardly any service in fact no  service at all, they almost throw the stuff at you ... yet people go  back and they now have much more stock. Why? fancy uniforms? Music?   locations ... not really, just consistently low prices and clever  marketing of one off products.

  Aldi just built a new store deliberately right next to the Woollies at Thornleigh, this is on a prime piece of land, which the developers would have loved to get and put up a set of ugly apartments. 
Aldi is cheaper but so is their food, their fresh food section is crap (not that woolies is the best but it's 100 times better than Aldi's attempt),  and they don't sell anywhere near the products a Woolies / Coles stocks,  therefore you need to go to Woolies after Aldi to get the additional  items you need, which is pointless. 
In the early days Aldi used to stock a lot of good quality items from Germany etc,  now a lot of their food stuff is imported from China, you can keep that,  Woolies is also doing this, but as they stock 5 different brands you  will always find an Australian made equivalent so you buy this and leave  the berries for some other poor bugger to get hepatitis from  :Rolleyes: . 
Aldi's are also usually standalone stores, woolies are situated next to other shops, so you can go to the post office, butcher and groceries, you can't do that with a stand aloe store, if you go to Thornleigh Woolies any day it's packed, right across the road at Aldi you can park right at the lift, and there is hardly anyone there, because it's not convenient where they are, but that's what they are and that appeals to some, it also does not appeal to others, that's the beauty of choice, if you don;t like it you go elsewhere. 
Anyway we could discuss the Masters stores all night, I don;t see them closing stores anytime soon, they have teamed up with McDonalds to have McCafe's and junk food in strategic stores, Bunnings can't match that with a crappy sausage sandwich.
I'm hoping they get a grip on what they need to offer, and get about doing this, as I hate that there is a Monopoly on what's available to the consumer.

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## phild01

Aldi meat is crap.  They have very good fresh Tasmanian Salmon. They are selling Aus beetroot again.  They offer a choice between Chinese or Australian tinned fruit.  Their chocolate is streets ahead of what the Cadbury abortion is now.  I reckon Bird's Eye now supply their premium frozen chips, could be wrong but are identical.  No one sells a decent frozen meal.  Frozen pizzas are better than what you get at Coles or Woolies.  Fruit can be good at times though their bananas can be iffy.  Beers seem ok too.

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## METRIX

> Aldi meat is crap.

  Agree   

> They have very good fresh Tasmanian Salmon.

  I don't like Salmonella prefer Tuna   

> They are selling Aus beetroot again.

  Where was is coming from prior ?   

> They offer a choice between Chinese or Australian tinned fruit.

  I prefer fresh fruit   

> Their chocolate is streets ahead of what the Cadbury abortion is now.

  Agree, I don't think it's even chocolate, and their new packaging looks really cheap, like it's done with a inkjet printer with cheap refill ink   

> I reckon Bird's Eye now supply their premium frozen chips

  Don't know I don't buy frozen chips, prefer to make fresh wedges   

> No one sells a decent frozen meal.

    Woollies used to sell fantastic spinach / feta gozleme, they disappeared one day never to be seen again   

> Frozen pizzas are better than what you get at Coles or Woollies.

  Don't buy them, prefer Normanhurst Pizza    

> Fruit can be good at times though their bananas can be iffy.

  Same as Woolies, all the bananas split a few days after getting them home, they must do something to them like most foods thes days   

> Beers seem ok too.

   Never tried theirs

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## phild01

> Where was is coming from prior ?   
> I prefer fresh fruit  
> Agree, I don't think it's even chocolate, and their new packaging looks really cheap, like it's done with a inkjet printer with cheap refill ink  
> Don't know I don't buy frozen chips, prefer to make fresh wedges  
>   Woollies used to sell fantastic spinach / feta gozleme, they disappeared one day never to be seen again  
> Don't buy them, prefer Normanhurst Pizza   
> Same as Woolies, all the bananas split a few days after getting them home, they must do something to them like most foods thes days  
>  Never tried theirs

  _Where was is coming from prior ?_
 Originally Australia, then China, now Australia again.  _I prefer fresh fruit_
So do I but the tinned peaches has got me hooked, must be a childhood thing  _Don't buy them, prefer Normanhurst Pizza_ 
Those ones make me fat whereas the nasty frozen ones aren't as bad.

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## Marc

Bunnings did not come overnight, that's right they started in 1886 and expanded by buying other hardware stores, BBC, Hardwarehouse etc, History of Bunnings | Bunnings Warehouse
Woolies, a success story in selling food, wants to start same size stores in similar locations overnight with no experience no history and poor advice.
I hope they can make it but it does not look good.
The quality of ALDI food is irrelevant if people buy it. It is their strategy to capture market share that is something to look at.

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## OBBob

> ... they started in 1886 and expanded by buying other hardware stores ...

  
That's a whopping head start!

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## Marc

There is one more thing, purely speculative from my part ... I wonder if Woollies would have the same interest if Coles was not part of Wesfarmers who own Bunnings.  
Sometimes the wrong motivation leads to blind mistakes.

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## METRIX

> There is one more thing, purely speculative from my part ... I wonder if Woollies would have the same interest if Coles was not part of Wesfarmers who own Bunnings.  
> Sometimes the wrong motivation leads to blind mistakes.

  possibly, but the market is worth $45 Billion a year, so that some incentive to try and grab some of it.
Both of them have their fingers in every pie these days.

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## SilentButDeadly

Any ideas on the situation in regional areas in terms of Masters/Bunnings et al with store turnover/financial returns? I know that Masters doesn't have great regional penetration at this point but given that their site selection options are typically far better in regional cities then this issue might be less of a problem. 
In my nearest regional town we do have a Bunnings which is now being expanded (for a second time) to take in a co-located trade supply space (currently located in another part of town).  However, Masters have acquired a large parcel on the same road , just a tad closer to town.  They've had it for a while along with planning permission to develop but have obviously elected not to go ahead at this time.   
Make me wonder though whether they shouldn't have a crack if they can get profitable regional stores going at the expense of not profitable suburban enterprises...

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## David.Elliott

Bunnings did not come overnight, that's right they started in 1886  Bunning Brothers - Follow My Ride. 
Not mentioned here but they had a mill in Jarrahdale too, So did ALCO, (Australian Lumber Company), and Millars plus Whittakers had some further south. 
The dartboard surround at the Jarrahdale Tavern including a blackboard scoreboard has in gold signwriting, "Donated by Millars Timber and Trading Company"
The "old" general store in town used to the the Millars Co-Op, where everybody got their supplies.
the Old Post Office is now home to the Jarrahdale Heritage Society. Dropped in there again the other day, and came across some documents and photos relating to the export of Jarrah for roads in Britain.
I have no idea how many millions of square feet of timber was sent. Enough to say, there are shots of main roads in cities paved with Jarrah.  
Of all of them Bunnings seems to be the survivor...As they originated here in WA I had been there in the early days. A far cry from the sorry excuse they can be for a hardware store now...

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## Vivvo

I remember them being called Bunnings Bros. when I was an apprentice back in WA. Used to have to make a coffee for the sales rep on his weekly visit to get our order.
No you read it right..they used to come and collect your timber order, at least once a week.   :Rofl:  They steadily grew from being a hardwood lumber supplier, mostly Jarrah and Karri. Bought out a lot of the other timber suppliers around WA, and hardware.

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## OBBob

Interesting article ... Mitre 10 and Home Hardware to merge. I'm not sure I share the view that they will be a major threat to Bunnings though ... well not for quite some time. Didn't Mitre 10 already try the Mega stores some time ago (or was that someone else ... the orange ones)?  Mitre 10 and Home Hardware tie-up could challenge Bunnings

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## SilentButDeadly

> Interesting article ... Mitre 10 and Home Hardware to merge. I'm not sure I share the view that they will be a major threat to Bunnings though ... well not for quite some time. Didn't Mitre 10 already try the Mega stores some time ago (or was that someone else ... the orange ones)?  Mitre 10 and Home Hardware tie-up could challenge Bunnings

  A potential tie-up between M10 and Home is one thing.  The fact that it'd bring Metcash (M10) and Woolworths (Home/ThriftyLink/PlantsPlus) to the table (and therefore place Masters into the mix) is potentially intimidating to to Wesfarmers especially in the trade side of hardware (not so much the retail).   
If Woolies decided to offload (or partner up) their Masters and Danks (Home etc) businesses to Metcash then it would truly be...quite interesting.  Especially given the potential mix of mega company stores and franchise operations across a broad spectrum of the suburban, regional and remote markets...Wesfarmers doesn't have this sort of market presence even if they leverage off their rural supplies niche to enter the small/medium & trade hardware game in the regions

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## Gaza

Woolworths own hudsons timber plus few other big time trade based timber outlets around Australia,
They operate separate to masters business maybe they should let the timber guys into run masters, 
Miter 10 / met cash also owns and joint owns a number of trade outlets where they have pumped money in   
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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