# Forum Home Renovation Bathrooms  Using stud adhesive in tiled wet area walls

## shinyhead

I've completely stripped our ensuite back to studs to prepare for new plasterboard then wall tiling with 500x500 on one wall and 500x250 on the other walls. Previously the painted plasterboard wall had obvious flaws in its flatness. From what I understand, now we are covering the wall with large tiles we need a flat substrate as imperfections in the plasterboard will be even more noticeable with tiles than a painted wall. 
As expected, the studs aren't completely plumb/straight over a 2.5m wall. There is a variation of +/-5mm from ceiling to floor and from corner to corner. To rectify this I was planning to use 3-5mm shims to pack out the studs where required and allow the stud adhesive to smooth out the other variations. Obviously using recommended fixing screws in the process. 
According to  the "Gyprock installation guide" it states that "stud adhesive MUST NOT be used on TILED WET AREA systems" and to only secure the gyprock using screws/nails at the required spacings. 
My question is why 'Gyprock' says "MUST NOT" use stud adhesive on their product in wet/tiled areas? The plasterboard we stripped from these walls was supposedly installed by a professional and had BOTH screws AND adhesive, including behind the tiled area in the shower enclosure. What is the problem with using stud adhesive in this situation? 
If I shim the studs and only screw the gyprock, won't the imperfections be more noticeable than if I use stud adhesive as well?

----------


## phild01

As I understand this, stud adhesive will shrink and draw the wall lining in.  Consequently it will also pop fixings that land on the adhesive.  Another drawback is that it is only holding the back of the board whereas fixings hold from the lining board face for greater strength.
I never use adhesive for tiled areas.
You may need 9mm villaboard for heavy large format tiles.

----------


## Oldsaltoz

Avoid using 'plasterboard' in wet areas, one tiny pin hole and the plaster inside turns into mud. Cheap builders use it because it's cheaper than Villaboard. 
You van adjust your packers to compensate for the thickness and have no problems using stud adhesive, but keep away from fixings and cover every one of them with a sealant before waterproofing. 
Good luck and fair winds.   :Smilie:

----------


## phild01

> Avoid using 'plasterboard' in wet areas, one tiny pin hole and the plaster inside turns into mud. Cheap builders use it because it's cheaper than Villaboard. 
> You van adjust your packers to compensate for the thickness and have no problems using stud adhesive, but keep away from fixings and cover every one of them with a sealant before waterproofing. 
> Good luck and fair winds.

  Considering the number of fixings required, it's not easy to avoid hitting the stud adhesive.  Have not yet seen in the recommendations that stud adhesive is okay to use.  Seems to be an unofficial alternate fixing method! 
Also strongly suggest villaboard over plasterboard.

----------


## sol381

In the shower area use villaboard..where you are going to tile dont use stud adhesive but put nails at about 200mm centres..

----------


## shinyhead

Thanks for the clearing up the adhesive issue. Apart from the shrinkage  problem, Gyprock's recommended fixing spacing is 200mm max up to 12kg/m2  and 100mm max for up to 32kg/m2 and no fixing is to be used closer than  200mm to adhesive for the popping reason already mentioned. 
As far as villaboard vs "plasterboard" I just wanted to confirm a couple of things.... 
The sheeting I am planning to use is Gyprock Aquacheck which is rated  for wet areas as opposed to regular plasterboard. They also recommended  waterproofing prior to tiling in shower recess. I'm assuming this  product is unlikely to turn to mud with minor damage as opposed to  regular plasterboard and because we are tiling the whole wall any damage  is highly unlikely anyway. Am I correct to think that? 
Additionally they allow up to 32kg/m2 tiling on this sheeting and based  on our tile weight, I estimate tile+grout+adhesive+waterproofing will be  less than 25kg/m2 so the extra strength of villaboard might not be an  issue. 
As a DIYer who hasn't done much tiling, the biggest advantage I see with  villaboard is they claim you can remove/replace tiles without damaging  the sheeting unlike removing tiles from Gyprock which will destroy the  lining if I happen to screw things up. 
While I've been typing this I think I've convinced myself the extra  couple hunj dollars for villaboard in this small room is probably cheap  insurance. 
Never used villaboard before so I'll research the installation  requirements but any suggestions from the educated will be appreciated.

----------


## m6sports

Use villaboard it's no different to work with.. To cut if just by some FC cutters  Craftright Rubber Grip Handle Fibro Cement Sheet Cutter | Bunnings Warehouse 
wet area board has its place but I can't see why people would use it in a bathroom......

----------


## METRIX

Choose Villaboard every day over gyprock in wet areas, you will need to prime the sheets before waterproofing, as was said above cheap builders use gyprock in wet areas, it matches in perfectly with the yellow tongue flooring they install as well  :Tongue:  
Aquachek is fine is a kitchen, but I wouldn't choose it for a bathroom, use one of the tiling levelling systems, these will help you achieve a good result, also use a cement based glue, DON'T use premixed stuff, it's NOT suitable for use in wet areas or over waterproofing compounds.

----------


## shinyhead

I am sold on villaboard. Do I need 9mm? 
According to Villaboard Lining manual...
6mm VB on 600mm max stud Ctrs allows max 9mm tile thickness (450mm ctrs max 13mm tiles) 
My tiles are 500x500x8mm and weigh about 4.5kg each
Studs vary 500-560 ctrs 
Guessing 6mm would meet their guidelines??

----------


## mudbrick

G'day, it's not important what each tile weighs only the weight per square metre, so in your case 4 tiles per square metre because even if your tiles were 250x250x8mm they would weigh the same amount per square metre. The only difference would be there are 16 of them rather than 4. Same load on the glue and on the sheet and fixings.
It sounds like 6mm VB is OK for you if the 6mm is rated to 9mm tiles and yours are only 8mm.
Just be sure to use enough nails and a couple extra for good measure  :Smilie:

----------


## METRIX

> I am sold on villaboard. Do I need 9mm? 
> According to Villaboard Lining manual...
> 6mm VB on 600mm max stud Ctrs allows max 9mm tile thickness (450mm ctrs max 13mm tiles) 
> My tiles are 500x500x8mm and weigh about 4.5kg each
> Studs vary 500-560 ctrs 
> Guessing 6mm would meet their guidelines??

  6mm is fine, as mudbrick said, don't skimp on the nails, I'm not a fan of 600 centres, I prefer 450, run a long level across the studs to check for any major discrepancies, fix these before installing villa-board.

----------


## gpkennedy

And, of course, take a note of the location of any water pipes before picking up a hammer.

----------


## METRIX

> And, of course, take a note of the location of any water pipes before picking up a hammer.

   :2thumbsup:  
Photos of the bare walls are good as well

----------


## shinyhead

Thanks 6mm it is. Need to put in some packers to even out the stud faces a bit. Not much variation over the whole wall (+2mm/-5mm) easy to fix. 
Villaboard manual only says to use Gal FC Nails. Are they regular gal clouts or is there something special about Fibre Cement nails? Also is it ok/better to srcew or use ring shank nails instead for a stronger hold or is there a reason they don't mention these fixings in the guides?

----------


## mudbrick

Don't use clouts they are not strong enough. The green shed will sell the proper fibre cement nails. Some poeple do screw it instead with the proper screws. Hammering nails is more though fun though  :Smilie:

----------


## shinyhead

> Don't use clouts they are not strong enough. The green shed will sell the proper fibre cement nails. Some poeple do screw it instead with the proper screws. Hammering nails is more though fun though

  Agreed with the fun factor. But 1st concern is weight of fully tiled wall nailed to pine studs, any chance of movement with FC nails?
2nd concern with fun factor is my son is keen to help but I trust his precision with the cordless drill way more than his aim hammering nails. :Eek:

----------


## phild01

The fc nails will hold the weight fine, and I find this easier then trying to flush drive screws into the stuff.

----------


## METRIX

> Agreed with the fun factor. But 1st concern is weight of fully tiled wall nailed to pine studs, any chance of movement with FC nails?
> 2nd concern with fun factor is my son is keen to help but I trust his precision with the cordless drill way more than his aim hammering nails.

  Nails will hold the board perfectly well as it's required to be fixed every 200mm on the edges, and 250 max in the centres, plus for tiled walls it also gets fixed into the top and bottom plates, it will not move.
Villaboard is very tough stuff, as long as you don't thump the daylights out of it not over a stud, you shouldn't damage it. 
Agree with Phil, I prefer to Nail villaboard on.

----------

