# Forum Home Renovation Asbestos  Asbestos in internal walls

## PVS

Hi All, 
I am new to this forum and so far have been very grateful for the enormous wealth of information I have gained from reading all your posts!  :2thumbsup:  
My partner and I just bought a brick veneer, I think 1940's house a couple of weeks ago. It is in original condition, so we plan to do a fairly major cosmetic renovation. 
I have read many of the threads in this sectin and learnt that asbestos was commonly used between the 1940's and 1980's, and would be most common inside the house among wet areas such as kitchen and bathroom etc - but it never really occured to me that it could be used in internal walls  :Eek:  
We went to have another look at the house today (we havent settled yet) and my father in law was knocking on the bedroom walls and insisted it sounded very hollow - not like the sound of plasterboard. He insisted it could be asbestos?? 
All of the main walls (lounge, dining, bedrooms) are covered from floor to ceiling in wallpaper...ripping off the wall paper was going to be my first task!  
So my question to you wise ones, I have read that asbestos wasn't extremely common in internal walls (hopefully I am not one of the unlucky ones), are there any giveaway signs to indicate it might asbestos? Or is the old horsehair plaster board a lot thinner / more hollow to what we use these days? 
Any dead give away signs that might indicate it's asbestos? 
It has beautiful art deco plaster ceiling work...so I just assumed the adjoining walls would be plaster too??!!  :Cry:  
Any help or advice would be warmly appreciated....thankyou!!!! 
PVS

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## dazzler

Sounds like my place! 
The horse hair plaster is very dull when tapped and couldnt possibly be mistaken for asbestos.  I think you have asbestos.  But hey its not the big boogy man that is made out provided you leave it alone or if removing it do it according to the safety instructions.  I have pulled out a lot of asbestos and never had an issue.  Its just time consuming and hot and sticky in summer.

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## GeoffW1

Hi, 
Drill a small hole and see what is on the drill bit. Grey - fibro (hence asbestos), white - plaster. 
Cheers

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## watson

Check the sticky about drilling too.

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## Bloss

Tapping will not tell you much if anything. Easier not to drill in this circumstance - the colour of the powders is not so stark as between grey & white although the older asbestos panels themselves were a light grey. Later panels (from the 60s) were also produced in a pale pink, but still had asbestos in them! I assume there is no building inspection report from the vendor? 
Just as an aside and not casting aspersions at you, but I can't understand the common resistance to getting a building report costing a few hundred dollars on a possible investment of hundreds of thousands.  :Frown:  
Plaster walls can be dented by a finger nail or a screwdriver tip quite easily - asbestos sheeting will feel very hard. So in a plaster wall the painted surface will push in easily - on an asbestos wall you will be able to put a scratch on the paint surface but pushing in will be very difficult. A 1940s house might also have masonite internal walls - so chocolate brown sawdust or appearance when scratched. 
In any case as you will see from the posts and stickies it's simply about awareness and appropriate action in dealing with the asbestos as you renovate etc even if it is on the wall linings.  :2thumbsup:

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## PVS

Thanks dazzler, I know now (thanks to this forum!) it's definitely not the be all and end all, I guess I am just trying to work out how much extra $$$ it will cost me if it is asbestos. I was hoping to just rip off the wallpaper and paint the walls, but in this case I would likely have to replaster the whole house...which I'm guessing will be a whole lot more expensive! Can I ask, did you replaster over yours, or get rid of the asbestos first??Thankyou GeoffW1 and watson, my partner actually looked under some of the peeling wallpaper, and thought it looked white...but as you said colour might not be the deciding factor.Bloss thanks a bunch, your post was extremely helpful, my dad suggested it may be masonite as well, in either case I suppose we would need to hang new plaster?And Bloss, I completely understand what you may be thinking - this could have been easily done if I'd gotten a building inspection done before hand??!!Basically we have been looking for a house in a particular cluster of suburbs approx 10km from the Melbourne CBD. I'm not sure if you have had much recent experience with the Melbourne market in these areas, but let me tell you, it is tough. We have been looking for 18 months, and every home in these areas are sold at auction. I have spent approx $3,500 on building inspections over the past year for houses we got outbidded on, and I haven't been unrealistic with expectations either - I'm talking houses that were quoted 480-520 and we bidded up till 600, and they've sold for 630!!! There was ONE house that went up for private sale during this period - advertised for 620 and sold for 693, and this was a private sale that turned into a bidding war...So basically this house came up, deceased estate with very keen vendors, was supposed to go to auction with a quote price of 580-620, it would have fetched at least 650 at auction, but they accepted an unconditional offer of 600 if we signed the deal before they started advertising - so it was an oppurtunity to good to refuse! The house is very clean and generally in great condition, and unfortunately in such a market we just didn't have time on our side....Sorry for the tangent and long winded post!!!Thankyou so much for all your help, I guess I will have to wait until settlement and properly investigate. I had just assumed most homes in that era would have the traditional thick horsehair plaster and the sound of those hollow walls got me off guard...if it is masonite or asbestos, I will just need to revise our reno budget!

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## GeoffW1

> Hi, 
> Drill a small hole and see what is on the drill bit. Grey - fibro (hence asbestos), white - plaster. 
> Cheers

  I should have said - don't breathe in.  :Mad:  You won't die of asbestosis if you stop breathing in  :Frown:  
Cheers

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## PVS

> I should have said - don't breathe in.  You won't die of asbestosis if you stop breathing in  
> Cheers

  Thanks GeoffW1...I dont plan to take a drill anywhere near the stuff without some serious heavy duty masking as well!! And read about wetting the area too to make sure less particles are released...thanks again  :Smilie:

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## PVS

Hi All, 
I just wanted to come back and update - the internal walls are made out of the old solid plaster, so asbestos  :2thumbsup:  
We do have some in the bathroom (tilux) and laundry and toilet walls as expected, but it's a huge relief now having some plaster walls in pretty good condition that we can work with. 
Thanks again to all for your help and advice!!! 
Off to the subflooring section I go to seek re-stumping advice.....   :Biggrin:

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## watson

Thanks for the update...keeps us in the loop  :2thumbsup:

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## Bedford

> I just wanted to come back and update - the internal walls are made out of the old solid plaster, so asbestos

  Is it asbestos or do you mean NOT asbestos? :Smilie:

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## PVS

> Is it asbestos or do you mean NOT asbestos?

  sorry - I meant so it's NOT asbestos!!!!  :Biggrin:  
Goes to show though as Bloss suggested tapping on the walls doesn't tell you much. All of the older homes I've looked at with old solid plaster had a very distinct dull sound when tapping, these don't. It must be some kind of a thinner plasterboard version of the old solid plaster  :Whatonearth:  
But I'm just happy because it's easier to work with, not in such bad condition either considering it's been covered in lovely floral wallpaper for most of it's lifetime!!! 
thanks again  :Smilie:

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## vfastbear

Many homes built in between the 20s and 60s and later had Fibrous Plaster in them, this is not asbestos.
The product was made in sheets of various sizes, including decorative panels.
The product was mainly just white plaster and the reinforcement was at the time sisal or horse hair ( these days its fibreglass ). 
The sheets were normally around 8-10mm or thicker. The plaster in the sheets is not that hard and can be scratched out fairly easily.
The sisal or horse hair can rot out but usually can seen on broken sheets.
Asbestos sheeting ( to my knowledge ) Is Cement with Asbestos reinforcement, in walls and ceiling is commonly around 6mm thick  (and thicker in particular applications ) and in walls and ceiling is quite hard although when used as underlays in floors could be much softer.
( I worked in the fibrous plaster industry for 9 years ).
Hope this helps.
Tony - vfastbear.

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## Bloss

Asked and answered I think . . . gotta watch the dates on the posts . . . :Wink:

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## PVS

Yep problem solved! 
Thankyou vfastbear for your input, I can only see the horsehair when the plaster is broken ripped - so yes definitley fibrous plaster!   :Smilie:

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## g_strait

> Hi All, 
> I am new to this forum and so far have been very grateful for the enormous wealth of information I have gained from reading all your posts!  
> My partner and I just bought a brick veneer, I think 1940's house a couple of weeks ago. It is in original condition, so we plan to do a fairly major cosmetic renovation. 
> I have read many of the threads in this sectin and learnt that asbestos was commonly used between the 1940's and 1980's, and would be most common inside the house among wet areas such as kitchen and bathroom etc - but it never really occured to me that it could be used in internal walls  
> We went to have another look at the house today (we havent settled yet) and my father in law was knocking on the bedroom walls and insisted it sounded very hollow - not like the sound of plasterboard. He insisted it could be asbestos?? 
> All of the main walls (lounge, dining, bedrooms) are covered from floor to ceiling in wallpaper...ripping off the wall paper was going to be my first task!  
> So my question to you wise ones, I have read that asbestos wasn't extremely common in internal walls (hopefully I am not one of the unlucky ones), are there any giveaway signs to indicate it might asbestos? Or is the old horsehair plaster board a lot thinner / more hollow to what we use these days? 
> Any dead give away signs that might indicate it's asbestos? 
> It has beautiful art deco plaster ceiling work...so I just assumed the adjoining walls would be plaster too??!!  
> ...

  I also live in an old house built in the same era. It's internal walls are made of the early wood ply board, & also sounds hollow when you tap it. It looks like my bathroom has asbestos in the fibro walls, which are covered with that horrible splotchy painted stuff, (which I know is some sort of fibro), with black joiner strips. Nasty looking bathroom really. I am going to paint it WHITE, so it's not so dark! I also have that awful horsehair plaster above the plywood/fibro  panels, of which most have been either painted, in the 36 years we've been here. Good luck with your identification, & I hope it's not fibro.
g_strait

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## g_strait

I also live in an old house built in the same era. It's internal walls are made of the early wood ply board, & also sounds hollow when you tap it. It looks like my bathroom has asbestos in the fibro walls, which are covered with that horrible splotchy painted stuff, (which I know is some sort of fibro), with black joiner strips. Nasty looking bathroom really. I am going to paint it WHITE, so it's not so dark! I also have that awful horsehair plaster above the plywood/fibro panels, of which most have been either painted, in the 36 years we've been here. Good luck with your identification, & I hope it's not fibro.
g_strait

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## asbestos

The only way to know for sure if a material contains asbestos is to submit a sample to a lab. Its should cost around 70 dollars and there are lots of kits available online.   Asbestos Removal Perth Western Australia

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## martrix

> The only way to know for sure if a material contains asbestos is to submit a sample to a lab. Its should cost around 70 dollars and there are lots of kits available online.   Asbestos Removal Perth Western Australia

  can you post some links?

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## JWH

We recently used these people.  Response was within week and cost was as advertised at $99.  Issue was linoleum tiles in foyer of squash courts and yes they had highly bonded asbestos.  Just sent a sample by post in plastic bag Home | Asbestos Labs

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