# Forum Home Renovation Lighting  Two switches to one light

## bigGayAl

Hi, 
With the standard way of connecting two switches to one light, the switches don't have "on" and "off" positions. It depends on the position of the other switch. 
This can be a problem when you cannot see the light from the switch. For example, an indoor switch controlling an outdoor light. To switch off an outdoor light, you have to walk out and look at the light. If it is on, you walk back in and flip the switch. 
Is there any way to have a switch where you can turn off a light without knowing if the light is on or off? 
Thanks, 
Al

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## chrisp

I'm not sure if I understand your needs exactly, but as you have said, with normal 2-way switching, the switch position for off changes depending upon the other switch. 
You could have two switches wired on series so the light doesn't come on unless both switches are on.  You could have a 'master' to turn it off and a 'slave' that is usually used to turn it off and on - but only when the master is on.  This might be too confusing though as there will be 3 possible off combinations and only 1 on combination.

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## chrisp

Another idea is to use a conventional 2-way switch setup, and have a pilot light installed near the inside switch so you know if the outdoor light is on.

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## bigGayAl

I was thinking of complicated solutions, such as a current sensing pilot light or electronic switches controlling a relay.
A pilot light wired parallel to the outdoor light and installed near the indoor switch seems like a far more sensible idea.

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## applied

Just Have the standard mechs replaced with 30/nm clipsal models they have a small 1watt neon indicator built into them that would indicate on or off.

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## Bros

> Just Have the standard mechs replaced with 30/nm clipsal models they have a small 1watt neon indicator built into them that would indicate on or off.

  How would that work as you don't have a neutral at the 2 way switches?

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## applied

The electrician shouldn't have a problem sorting it.  http://www.clipsal.com/trade/__data/page/81/W275.pdf

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## Bros

> The electrician shouldn't have a problem sorting it.  http://www.clipsal.com/trade/__data/page/81/W275.pdf

  Not a simple as you made it out to be.

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## applied

Doesn't seem that hard. You call the guy he comes and does the job you pay him he leaves. Job well done  :Smilie:

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## bigGayAl

The clipsal wiring diagram is a bit hard to decipher but it just involves having a neon pilot bulb parallel to the light. Obviously, additional wiring is required but the pilot light is built into the switch so it is nice and neat. 
Here is a diagram showing the extra wiring required.

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## applied

If additional wirings not your thing you could use a 31vetr timer switches, motion sensors or daylight switches.

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## Bros

> Doesn't seem that hard. You call the guy he comes and does the job you pay him he leaves. Job well done

  Well if you put it that way I have to agree but is is not the normal two way switching as you have to add some extra wiring not just replace the switch and that's it.

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## applied

*Information supplied within posts is not to be considered formal instruction to complete a task

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## droog

Al there is a down side to what you want to do.
Our house has a setup as you suggest with multiple switches around the house (10 or so) all switching the outside lights on. This was done by previous owners, yes a sparky, using a contactor. 
The down side is that if I find the outside lights on I then have to check every switch to find the one (or more) that has been left on, I cannot go to the first switch and change its position to turn the lights off.
An indicator to show when the lights or on would be a much better solution in my opinion. 
Regards Dave

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## chrisp

> The down side is that if I find the outside lights on I then have to check every switch to find the one (or more) that has been left on, I cannot go to the first switch and change its position to turn the lights off.

  I think what is being proposed in this thread is different.  Any switch will turn the light off or on.  The indicator is just to indicate if the light is off or on. 
I suspect your setup is multiple switches in parallel rather than a multiway switch set up.

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## droog

Yep multiple parallel switches operating a contactor for the lights. 
Usually people associate the position of the mech with a light being on / off, ie down / up. 
Multiway switching (with an indicator if needed) is a much better idea.

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## r3nov8or

set up a series of well placed mirrors so you can see the outside light from the inside switch. Put water features in front of the mirrors to disguise their true purpose.  :Smilie:

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## manofaus

two switches to light fixture momentary switch. Latching circuit at the light fixture for on. Off to break latching circuit. unless you can find a three way momentary switch

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