# Forum Home Renovation Television, Computers & Phones  NBN connection - What is this box for?

## Slowrenos

My house is "NBN ready", according to the many communications I have received, and the landline will be cut off in August.  I have tried to inform myself as to the nitty-gritty of the "installation". After several visits to my local Telstra shops (mostly unhelpful) I have at last got it straight that my place will have Fibre to the Curb.  A nice young man explained to me yesterday that this meant bringing new wiring along the street to the phone pit just outside my fence, and leaving the wiring from there to the house as is.  Connect new modem or whatever-it-is inside the house, and Bob's your uncle.
If that's how it's done, what is the purpose of this box an NBN technician fixed to my outside wall ages ago?  The wire comes from a pole on the other side of the street.  I always thought It was the NBN connection point.
Neither the young man nor his senior colleague could tell me why it was there. Can anyone?

----------


## Jon

That looks like your existing telephone wiring is aerial via drop wires rather than underground.
I guess fibre to the kerb would work the same over that, just a few extra metres of cable involved.
What suburb?

----------


## METRIX

That box is where they will connect a wire from to the insides of your house to the NBN modem.
These boxes were installed as part of the NBN rollout years ago, in my area there is a fly lead connected to the NBN network on the pole and it terminates inside this box. 
When the NBN was connected here they joined the wire inside this box to the new wire they ran inside the house to the modem, so until that happens that box is doing nothing. 
Be warned, when you connect to NBN expect it to be unreliable, if you sign up for a plan ensure to get one that supplies the newer modems that have a 4G backup sim inside. 
This is for when the NBN network goes down (which it will) the 4G will still allow you to have internet access.
Without this 4G backup you will lose Internet, and any other TV services you signed up for as part of the package, I notice Telstra is now flogging this 4G backup modem on TV, so they also know the NBN network is unreliable. 
My friend lost NBN for over 10 days recently, half the street had NBN half did not, as they did not have the newer type of modem they had no internet for that 10 days.

----------


## craka

To me it looks like an aerial feed, copper pair lead-in.   If you are in a FTTC (Fibre to the Kerb except American spelling) , fibre is run along each street and is connected to what they call a DPU which is in a pit, the DPU then has four copper outputs, one for each dwelling.   The copper is connected to each dwelling using existing copper pair lead in for the most part, I believe but unsure that if there were pair gain being used prior to that NBN would have to run in new copper pair lead-in in such instances.   
I believe FTTC whilst not as good as FTTP is quite good, and in time will be alot more speed upgrade-able. I believe NBN were trialing or testing G.Fast connections over FTTC .

----------


## craka

> That box is where they will connect a wire from to the insides of your house to the NBN modem.
> These boxes were installed as part of the NBN rollout years ago, in my area there is a fly lead connected to the NBN network on the pole and it terminates inside this box. 
> When the NBN was connected here they joined the wire inside this box to the new wire they ran inside the house to the modem, so until that happens that box is doing nothing. 
> Be warned, when you connect to NBN expect it to be unreliable, if you sign up for a plan ensure to get one that supplies the newer modems that have a 4G backup sim inside. 
> This is for when the NBN network goes down (which it will) the 4G will still allow you to have internet access.
> Without this 4G backup you will lose Internet, and any other TV services you signed up for as part of the package, I notice Telstra is now flogging this 4G backup modem on TV, so they also know the NBN network is unreliable. 
> My friend lost NBN for over 10 days recently, half the street had NBN half did not, as they did not have the newer type of modem they had no internet for that 10 days.

  NBN is for the most part quite stable, all Telcos have their moments. For instance Telstra the year before last had approximately half if not more of their network down on the eastern side of the country, due to a joint being damage in central nsw.  
The 4G backup is just something Telstra and other Telcos can aim their marketing at. Prior to NBN, other connection options were available with 4G backup.

----------


## Slowrenos

Hi from Frankston, Jon (outer SE Melbourne).
Thanks for the replies, guys - but now I'm more confused than ever.  The existing landline connection certainly comes underground, and I've always assumed that it came from the pit on the footpath.  The conduit carrying the wire emerges from the ground not all that far from the pit, and dead in line with it.  It goes under the house to a junction box, and from there four cream-coloured wires go off to the four phone points in the house.  
The Fibre to the Curb connection process, as the young man outlined it, made sense if the pit is where the my existing wiring is to meet the NBN cabling.   
Metrix, you've described a different process -  one I'm familiar with, as I actually helped with it at my brother's place.  The techie installs NBN cabling right across the house (under or over - in my case it would be under) from an outside box to an inside box.  Modem in suitable spot, landline connected, all OK. 
 Problem:  I don't think that process is Fibre to the Curb.  And Fibre to the Curb is what they say I'll be getting.
It almost seems that I am out of line in wanting to know ahead of time how they're going to connect me.  The mantra is "the installer will sort all that out on the day".  Well, I don't like buying pigs in pokes.  
So I'm grateful for your warning about modems, Metrix.  Will make sure I get the 4G backup.

----------


## Slowrenos

Hi Craka - just now saw your posts.  As I read your description, something in the pit on my footpath is somehow connected to that wire from the pole on the other side of the street.  
I hadn't thought that possible.

----------


## craka

> Hi Craka - just now saw your posts.  As I read your description, something in the pit on my footpath is somehow connected to that wire from the pole on the other side of the street.  
> I hadn't thought that possible.

  Quite possibly.  Without being there its hard to be certain.  But with respect to a FTTC connection, there is DPU  that takes a fibre input and outputs to copper pairs that attach to copper pair lead-in to each dwelling.   More info on FTTC https://www.nbnco.com.au/learn/netwo...explained-fttc
If you're uncertain about what NBN technology you are going to be connected to you can go to the NBN address checker  ( https://www1.nbnco.com.au/connect-ho...k-your-address ). When you search your particular street address , it will display 'Technology used in your connection'  or something similar. Which will be either FTTN, FTTC, FTTP,  Fixed Wireless, Skymuster etc.

----------


## Slowrenos

Thanks for the links, Craka.  For my sins, I am now very familiar with the "check address" one.  I'll be saying FTTC in my sleep. 
But I still don't know what that wire and that box have to do with an FTTC connection process.

----------


## craka

> Thanks for the links, Craka.  For my sins, I am now very familiar with the "check address" one.  I'll be saying FTTC in my sleep. 
> But I still don't know what that wire and that box have to do with an FTTC connection process.

  Did NBN run that in ?   ie What your photo shows on the external wall.

----------


## Slowrenos

Yes - I reckon a couple of years ago.

----------


## craka

> Yes - I reckon a couple of years ago.

  I take it you weren't at the house at the time or do you mean Yes NBN did haul it there but your unsure on the timeframe?.   It's hard to be definite from the photo , but the cable in the photo is no coax for external TV antenna etc is it?

----------


## Slowrenos

No, it's not for the TV.  
I was here, and I remember talking to the bloke who did it.  NBN logo on his jumper or shirt.  The only part of the conversation I can swear to is that he asked me if I would prefer cabling to go through my roof space or under the floor.
(I said through the roof space.  I've since realised that under the floor is much more sensible. That's what worries me about "sort it out on the day" - if you haven't got  time to think, you make wrong decisions).
Does that sound like a conversation about FTTC?

----------


## craka

> No, it's not for the TV.  
> I was here, and I remember talking to the bloke who did it.  NBN logo on his jumper or shirt.  The only part of the conversation I can swear to is that he asked me if I would prefer cabling to go through my roof space or under the floor.
> (I said through the roof space.  I've since realised that under the floor is much more sensible. That's what worries me about "sort it out on the day" - if you haven't got  time to think, you make wrong decisions).
> Does that sound like a conversation about FTTC?

  Unsure it's hard to say what you have, especially if you already had a existing copper pair lead-in running underground from a pit. Did whoever hauled the cable in fit or connect it to a socket inside?

----------


## Slowrenos

No, all the work was done outside.

----------


## Whitey66

Could it be that the NBN optic fibre cable is only running down the opposite side of the street and they will make all the copper on your side redundant once everyone is connected?
They may have had major issues running fibre to your side and this was the cheapest and easiest solution perhaps?
I can't think of any other reason to have this aerial cable coming from a pole on the other side of the street. This would still make your system a FTTC setup imho.

----------


## Slowrenos

If trenching is/was involved, the other side is the place for it.  My side is a jungle of ti-tree and agapanthus.  But are the NBN street cables underground?
I didn't take any notice when all the teams were doing things in pits round here.  It was a long time ago - second half of 2018.

----------


## Whitey66

A lot of FTTC is done by pulling cables through existing conduits and pits and a lot is underbored. Some are aerials too, I think it comes down to each specific location and what challenges are involved. I think the main decisions are made based on time and cost, not aesthetics.

----------


## Slowrenos

Well, I think your theory is a good one.   I'll assume that the box on the wall is my connection point.   (I always thought it was, but I couldn't absolutely swear that the young bloke who installed it said so.  It's only recently that the pit and its wiring have been brought into the picture).  
I'd love to be able to speak to a real person at the NBN, ask "What are your plans for my place" and get an accurate, user-friendly answer.  Dream on.
 I might as welI give up and "sort it out with the installer on the day".  Which, of course, is what they want me to do.

----------


## Bros

> I might as welI give up and "sort it out with the installer on the day".  Which, of course, is what they want me to do.

   If it is like my house it is self install, they send you the bits and the instruction and go ahead.

----------


## Slowrenos

I'd love that.  And that's how I understood the stuff I read about FTTC.  But when I mentioned it at my local Telstra shop, I copped an inexplicably hostile lecture - licensed techies only ones allowed to do installation etc. 
Intimidated, I assumed I'd read wrong and backed off.

----------


## Bros

> But when I mentioned it at my local Telstra shop

   Why would you bother going to those idiots. I do all my Telstra contacting on line and no matter how hard it is it is much better then our local Telstra shop. 
Self install for FTTC just remove the old phone connect the connection box then the modem and phone and you are away.   https://www.telstra.com.au/support/c...tc-connections

----------


## Slowrenos

With the exception of the bloke who gave me the serve, I've found the people nice enough - but I would've expected them to be much better informed.
Thanks for the link and the encouragement.

----------


## Jon

Telstra and NBN are totally seperate entities.   The simplest way to think of it is that NBN is the wholesaler and provides the infrastructure and then you choose the retailer of your choice for your service of which Telstra is just one.
Staff in a Telstra shop will generally have little knowledge of NBN infrastructure or delivery methods beyond what is publically available.  
To the OP, do you have an existing phone service and do you know if it is delivered via underground cable to your house or via overhead cable and drop wires from a pole?

----------


## Bros

> Telstra and NBN are totally seperate entities.

   They are but zi can’t speak for any other ISP but we waited for 6 mths before we changed over the NBN connection box came and the modem as soon as you connect up the connection box it does a change over to the NBN and your ADSL and phone is history. That is the theory but we had a problem with the DPC and a technician had to come.

----------


## joynz

I’m in Melbourne and when my NBN (FTTN) was hooked up, the Exetel technician also set up the modem.   
I have a land line phone too - but that number hadn’t been ported from Telstra at that point so he left the box for that with me and I connected it myself later.

----------


## Slowrenos

Hi Jon - see my post #6.

----------


## Jon

I can't think of any technical reason why they would go for aerial feed for NBN when there is already an underground lead in to the house.
My best guess is that originally your street/area was going to be HFC over existing cable tv infrastructure and that is what you have.  But since then  FTTC has become available and they shelved the HFC idea. 
Frankston appears to be fully NBN ready, ask around your neighbours and see how their's has been delivered.  Via original phone line or via new(ish) aerial cable.  Based on that you know what to expect.

----------


## METRIX

> Well, I think your theory is a good one. I'll assume that the box on the wall is my connection point. (I always thought it was, but I couldn't absolutely swear that the young bloke who installed it said so. It's only recently that the pit and its wiring have been brought into the picture). 
> I'd love to be able to speak to a real person at the NBN, ask "What are your plans for my place" and get an accurate, user-friendly answer. Dream on.
> I might as well give up and "sort it out with the installer on the day". Which, of course, is what they want me to do.

  Good luck speaking with anyone from NBN, they are like the "secret service", we know they exist but you cannot find or contact them.
The reasoning behind the installer sorting it out on the day is basically every job is different, I know this from working on hundreds of houses doing various jobs, there is no "one size fits all" scenario. 
It sounds easy to bring a line into the roof cavity then simply drop it down a wall to a point, unfortunately it's not that easy, a lot of time you have things in the cavity that stop you from doing that, there is obstructions in the roof, under the house etc that have been done to the house over the many years it's been there, so this all needs to be sussed out on the day, that's quite normal. 
My advice is to suss out your house, see what is the easiest way to install, sort out any tricky bits such as where YOU want the modem and find an easy solution to get the cable from the box to that point.
If you can do this the guys that install should be fine with doing it, if you can save them the work of trying to work out how to do it you should get what you want. 
If you want the cable in a certain spot and can drop draw lines etc to that point prior to them arriving, and speak to the guys showing them what you have done for them you will get the cable where you want it, if you leave it up to them you might not get what you want, as their job is to get the connection inside your house, if that connection is in a lounge or as study they don't really care as long as it's in the house because 90% of the connections are probably looked after by wireless after that, if they cab get it to a point that’s easy, or one that will take an extra few hours they will take the easy point first. 
Read this thread I started on my NBN experience, I found the difference between technicians is like chalk and cheese, some are good same are terrible, I got one of the terrible ones first, then got some of the good ones second, the first one had no interest in doing the job, the second ones were great, and were very appreciative I had helped sorted stuff out for them prior to arrival, such as drilling through the wall and running a draw line for them to attach to, these guys are just like any other trade, if you can help them out they will work with you.  https://www.renovateforum.com/f188/n...iences-127378/ 
But it's pot luck you might get one of the Lazy A-Holes I got for the first attempt, I did eventually speak to someone at NBN via email, I told them I didn't want the same guy that came out first, they said their policy is if the visit fails for some reason, they don't send the same guy back to attempt again, I assume they know there are lazy and good installers, and this may be a way of weeding them out. 
I did a job at a place and noticed the NBN modem was in the garage, I asked the owners why was it in there, they said that's where they said it had to go, BS this was done by a lazy installer, I could see there was a manhole in the garage roof and the garage was attached to the house, I was in the roof cavity and could see the cable could have been run to the insides of the house and modem put in a proper place, this was done by one of the lazy installers. 
The guys that did my one, I asked them to allow more cable so the connection could be moved at a later stage, they had no problem and asked where it might go, and allocated enough cable to move the connection later as required. 
As you will see by reading the below topic, previous house had Optus Cable, the guy that installed it was great, the connection point was on the 2nd story as the house was on a steep block, he ran the cable from the pole across the road, got it up to the connection point on the 2nd story, run the cable inside, allocated extra cable so the connection could be moved downstairs once the renovations were being done, connected it up all without any fuss or issues. 
This was why I went with Optus for NBN, as I had no complaints with the Cable service, was I wrong, it was a combination of Optus and NBN not knowing what was going on, and the Corona Virus was just starting to affect things around the world, Optus online / phone service went offline due to Corona and so the arduous journey of what should have been a simple thing to get a cable connected and supply a Fetch box started. 
The connection here is a HFC and randomly drops off, a lot of times it will drop off around 8.00pm and sometimes for only a minute sometimes for 30 minutes.
I receive weekly SMS from Optus that they are performing "Stability upgrades" on the network and will randomly switch it off around midnight to do these stability upgrades. 
I spoke to them last week to upgrade the modem to one equipped with the 4G SIM, as the modem I received is a non SIM equipped one,l they started rolling out he SIM equipped version a few weeks after I got the install. 
They said it was going to be difficult to do, but not impossible (here we go) and would have to sign up for a 36 month plan vs the 24 month one I'm currently on, I said fine just upgrade it as the connection was dropping off every 4 or 5 days.
I then got a reply saying they were having technical difficulties getting the plan swapped etc etc, so I just gave up, cannot be bothered to deal with them anymore. 
As of this morning this is the speed I have now, so it seems to fall in the Standard Plus range

----------


## craka

To the OP. I would just wait to see what the plan or what occurs on the day of install, otherwise it's all just speculation and possibly getting you worked up. If it doesn't go to plan or work etc, raise it with the retail provider. 
 Some retail providers are better than others with their support and there urgency at getting issues resolved.  All providers whether Optus, Telstra, etc are only retailers of a service over the NBN network now, they have nothing to do with NBN itself apart from purchasing wholesale bandwidth from NBN.

----------


## Bros

> Some retail providers are better than others with their support and there urgency at getting issues resolved.  All providers whether Optus, Telstra, etc are only retailers of a service over the NBN network now, they have nothing to do with NBN itself apart from purchasing wholesale bandwidth from NBN.

   Not entirely right as when I had to get my problem a Telstra bloke came and he told me he was a Telstra employee not a contractor. As far as I can see NBN put the cabling in test it and then leave and have no technicians and the retailers have to do the rest and i would expect any problem that was caused by NBN would be billed to them

----------


## Slowrenos

Thanks for the good advice, Metrix.  I followed your NBN saga at the time. The "rain" experience struck a chord - when I was householder's rep for the installation at my brother's place, the technician called the job off after ten minutes' work because of a few spits of rain.  I locked up and drove home in bright sunshine.  Re-scheduled - different bloke, very steady and patient with what turned out to be a time-consuming job.  He got me to give him a hand with the wall-cavity part of it.
I came home and decided exactly where I wanted the cabling to go at my place.  From the box up near the eaves, it has to drop down the cavity, then go across under the floor to the diningroom.  There's no problem with the brick veneer wall. I know it well - when I had the AC sheet in that room replaced by plasterboard, I was the person who straightened the studs.  Under the house, at that end, headroom is a bit limited - but other tradies have worked there and if necessary I can be cable monkey.  In the kitchen/diningroom wall, I have drilled my holes and installed my pull-cord. 
If the pit and the existing phone line are going to be used instead of the box on the wall, this scheme actually becomes simpler.  The old junction box is quite close to my hole in the floor.  I want the copper line to come up through my holes, not any of the old ones - that'll mean a new connection plate (whatever it's called).    
All fixed, really.  But it drives me nuts that NO-ONE can tell me which procedure they're planning to use.
And Telstra letterboxes me with missives saying "Got nbn questions? We have the answers".  Grrr! 
I think you're right, Craka.  Just leave it.

----------


## METRIX

> Thanks for the good advice, Metrix.  I followed your NBN saga at the time. The "rain" experience struck a chord - when I was householder's rep for the installation at my brother's place, the technician called the job off after ten minutes' work because of a few spits of rain.  I locked up and drove home in bright sunshine.  Re-scheduled - different bloke, very steady and patient with what turned out to be a time-consuming job.  He got me to give him a hand with the wall-cavity part of it.
> I came home and decided exactly where I wanted the cabling to go at my place.  From the box up near the eaves, it has to drop down the cavity, then go across under the floor to the diningroom.  There's no problem with the brick veneer wall. I know it well - when I had the AC sheet in that room replaced by plasterboard, I was the person who straightened the studs.  Under the house, at that end, headroom is a bit limited - but other tradies have worked there and if necessary I can be cable monkey.  In the kitchen/diningroom wall, I have drilled my holes and installed my pull-cord. 
> If the pit and the existing phone line are going to be used instead of the box on the wall, this scheme actually becomes simpler.  The old junction box is quite close to my hole in the floor.  I want the copper line to come up through my holes, not any of the old ones - that'll mean a new connection plate (whatever it's called).    
> All fixed, really.  But it drives me nuts that NO-ONE can tell me which procedure they're planning to use.
> And Telstra letterboxes me with missives saying "Got nbn questions? We have the answers".  Grrr! 
> I think you're right, Craka.  Just leave it.

  It's understandable they can't tell you what they will do, because there is nobody there, I can understand that.
Don;t worry about it, just wait for the guy to show up, show him what you would like and take it from there.

----------


## craka

> Not entirely right as when I had to get my problem a Telstra bloke came and he told me he was a Telstra employee not a contractor. As far as I can see NBN put the cabling in test it and then leave and have no technicians and the retailers have to do the rest and i would expect any problem that was caused by NBN would be billed to them

  Considering I work in the industry I might know. There are dedicated NBN technician, as there are dedicated Telstra technicians. Then there are contractors that wear multiple hats, ie do work for a number of them.   Was he wearing a Telstra uniform?

----------


## Bros

> Was he wearing a Telstra uniform?

  Can't remember but he drove a truck with Telstra on it and I asked him is he a real Telstra person paid direct by Telstra and he said yes, can't do much more than that. 
When I go shopping and I see someone with a shirt with a logo or a hi vis shirt for curiosity I always look at the logo as I used to wear hi vis shirts with logo's and still do wear my old shirts when I need to but I have never seen a Telstra one.

----------


## craka

> Can't remember but he drove a truck with Telstra on it and I asked him is he a real Telstra person paid direct by Telstra and he said yes, can't do much more than that. 
> When I go shopping and I see someone with a shirt with a logo or a hi vis shirt for curiosity I always look at the logo as I used to wear hi vis shirts with logo's and still do wear my old shirts when I need to but I have never seen a Telstra one.

  Ok I think I get where your coming from your retail provider is also Telstra?     If so yes. Dependent on what the issue or work that is involved as it may not be in the scope of NBN. For instance one of the particular carriers I do work for, act as a provider in this instance and connect customers via NBN  . I go onsite to do work for the carrier not NBN, if there is an issue related to NBN, NBN need to organise a NBN technician.  For instance I've had instances where a site in a suburban FTTN area has been redeveloped but no first socket or mdf has been fitted, it is NBNs responsibility to resolve that.    The default is NBN usually make/request that the retailer make certain that the retailer side/responsibility is not the faulty area.

----------


## Bros

> Ok I think I get where your coming from your retail provider is also Telstra?     If so yes.

  Yes it is   

> I go onsite to do work for the carrier not NBN, if there is an issue related to NBN, NBN need to organise a NBN technician.  For instance I've had instances where a site in a suburban FTTN area has been redeveloped but no first socket or mdf has been fitted, it is NBNs responsibility to resolve that.    The default is NBN usually make/request that the retailer make certain that the retailer side/responsibility is not the faulty area.

  Woundn't that make the customer happy who just wants his internet.They have a visit from the technician contracted by the ISP then the job goes to NBN contractor then back to the ISP contractor for the final connection. 
I've always wondered what non Telstra customers do as far as on site technical assistance.

----------


## craka

> Yes it is   
> Woundn't that make the customer happy who just wants his internet.They have a visit from the technician contracted by the ISP then the job goes to NBN contractor then back to the ISP contractor for the final connection. 
> I've always wondered what non Telstra customers do as far as on site technical assistance.

  Not dissimilar to electrical wholesale really, say you suspect there is issue with metering of your power, you need to contact your retail provider go through it all with them and then the retail provider needs to investigate or log a call with the wholesaler.  
That is what I'm saying Telstra really apart from having historic maintenance on lines have nothing to do with NBN, so 'site technical assistance' is not any different from any other provider. They are just a retail provider over NBN, same for Optus or any other 'traditional carriers' they all operate as a retail provider when using NBN as the network.

----------


## Bros

> Not dissimilar to electrical wholesale really, say you suspect there is issue with metering of your power, you need to contact your retail provider go through it all with them and then the retail provider needs to investigate or log a call with the wholesaler.

  Retail and wholesale one in the same here Ergon only.   

> That is what I'm saying Telstra really apart from having historic maintenance on lines have nothing to do with NBN, so 'site technical assistance' is not any different from any other provider. They are just a retail provider over NBN, same for Optus or any other 'traditional carriers' they all operate as a retail provider when using NBN as the network.

  Proberbly Telstra has historically had more staff so they can service their retail customers and I would suspect probably subcontract for other providers.

----------


## craka

> Retail and wholesale one in the same here Ergon only.   
> Proberbly Telstra has historically had more staff so they can service their retail customers and I would suspect probably subcontract for other providers.

  Unsure how you Electrical networks work up there, but in NSW there are retailer providers  and the wholesaler since privatisation a few years ago.  
Telstra don't sub contract their own staff out to other carriers.   They do sub out work on their own Telstra network (yes a Telstra network still exists but mainly their own fibre ) to sub contractors though, as do NBN sub out work to contractors on their NBN network but not other carriers.

----------

