# Forum Home Renovation Fences & Screens  Fixing horizontal hardwood battens to posts

## mattwilliams78

Has anyone got any neat suggestions or tricks for this one? 
I'm building a new front fence next week and I want to attach hardwood slats horizontally to the posts and I've bought some pretty shmick stainless fixings. Obviously I would like to have a neat single row of fixings as they will stand out but the problem is that the fence steps down a slight slope, losing one batten every 2.4m ish. 
The attached image shows the issue. The top batten (A) ends at a post so one pair of fittings in a vertical line. Trouble is, below that batten some battens will butt up against each other needing a pair of fixings either side of the join (B) but some battens will be long enough to span two or more "bays" so will only need one pair of fixings (C). 
I'm wondering whether if I cut the ends of the batten at 45deg I can join two battens (D)with one pair of fittings? Trouble is, at 20mm thick it doesn't give much margin for error or space to get the fittings in whole, especially the top one with a countersink in. Also over time could the battens expand slightly differently and drive this joint apart? 
Would I be better to just use a few extra fittings and use 2 pairs per post as per (B) whether it needs both rows or not? 
Or, am I being far too pedantic?? haha.

----------


## Fenced Out

Have you considered a vertical cover strip over the scews?
It will save a load of trouble and if you make an error you have it covered! :2thumbsup:

----------


## ScroozAdmin

Would look neater with single line of fasteners imo, what about scarf jointing it across the face instead of through the width, wouldn't have to be over a post then or could be if you wanted to make a feature of it.

----------


## mattwilliams78

thanks, but what's a scarf joint? I think the neat single row would be best too but I'm probably going to resign myself to the using extra fixings for a double row whether I need it or not. 
Like the strip cover idea though, if I have enough spare that could be a neat trick too.

----------


## zoj

I think your idea of using pairs regardless of whether you need them or not is a good one to maintain uniformity,especially if they are " shmick"   :Biggrin: 
Mind me asking what program you used to draw up that picture?
I sometimes cant get my ideas expressed into words and something like that is very useful.Thanks in advance.

----------


## mattwilliams78

its called "visio" and is part of the microsoft office suite (the pro one I think, not the home one, this is on my work computer). You could also do it in powerpoint or the "draw" tool bar inside word. 
There is an open (free) licence version too I think, try  "openoffice" or "staroffice" in google.

----------


## ScroozAdmin

> thanks, but what's a scarf joint?

  see pic, that's a structural one, theres a few different types but you get the basic idea.  :2thumbsup:

----------


## mattwilliams78

Thanks ScruffyDo. At first I thought, "um, not sure about that one - would be ideal for a beam but for a little batten?!" but actually the more I think about it the more I think it could work if I do it at the post. I could cut both at say 30-45deg (whatever gives me a 45mm wide joint through the 70mm tall batten) then I could put one screw in each corner of the scarfe. (see E) 
Only thing is, would I need something longitudinually joining the battens together, like a screw or nail, as shown? Would this stop the two mitred halves warping away from each other? or is this pretty unlikely to happen anyway? The battens will be oiled merbau.

----------


## Fenced Out

> Only thing is, would I need something longitudinually joining the battens together, like a screw or nail, as shown? Would this stop the two mitred halves warping away from each other? or is this pretty unlikely to happen anyway? The battens will be oiled merbau.

  You are working with timber in an outside harsh Australian climate that is always changing.
I'm sure your fence will look great for the first few months even year but sadly down the track it will start shrinking, warping and cracking.
To be honest cutting sharp angles, drilling and screwing a large number of screws into such a small slat of timber will only shorten the timbers life in such harsh climates.
Make sure you seal your joints well and keep the oil up to these areas.
This being one of the reasons I like to use a cover strip, it saves time and money, protects edges,prevents warping/twisting and creates a stronger fence. 
Best of luck!

----------


## ScroozAdmin

> Would this stop the two mitred halves warping away from each other? or is this pretty unlikely to happen anyway? The battens will be oiled merbau.

  not sure tbh, it was just a thought, maybe a joiners shop could advise or possibly joint up long lengths for you. 
Fenced out seems to know what he's on about so maybe his advice is best, keep it as simple as possible.  :Smilie:

----------


## mattwilliams78

butt joints it is then. I have enough extra screws to just put in the second row of fixings. Will cover over heads with a strip only if my lining up becomes attrocious - with SS screws pinning the battens down I'm hoping theres no significant warping going on?? 
Starting tomorrow, will post pics at the end of the week if anyone's interested......

----------


## Rex

How did the screening go mate? 
Interested in seeing it  :Smilie:

----------


## mattwilliams78

Sorry, very rude of me  :Smilie:  
First few pics show the gal posts and treated pine stand offs going on. I stained the TPs stand offs (well my mate did actually as the photo shows haha) with wattyl merbau stain and they came up really well! I'm so impressed I might even use TP to screen the underside of the house and just stain it rather than buying the merbau. I was going to paint the gal posts as well but once I found out about the cost of etch primer and black enamel I think I might leave it for a while and see if it really bothers me. 
The last few photos show the battens installed. Two issues jump out at me (but others probably won't even notice). 
1. I set up the first "bay" to have spirit leveled battens above, what I thought, was a level brick wall. Second bay, I continue the battens across at spirit level, but am picking up about 10mm extra gap below the batten over a 2100mm-ish bay. 3rd bay, and another 10mm gain. By the time I get to the fourth bay going down the slope I have gained about 40mm which now suggests I have an unlevel wall and therefore two diverging planes  :Frown:  I could probably solved all this if I had either a) checked the wall for level to begin with or b) started from the top of my posts and applied battens working down, following the fall of the wall. Instead I had first measured and concreted each post to be exacly 880mm above the wall below. 
2. Unfortunately, in my own mind perhaps, I have exaggerated this difference by then putting different sized battens on the top, with much larger gaps. I intentionally did this because NSW planning laws (the new Feb 09 ones) allow a 1200mm high front fence if the top 200mm is 50% transparent - presumably for the lattice work above a solid colourbond or timber lapped fence. Otherwise its the local planning laws with a max 1000mm solid. However, putting aside planning rules for a minute, it probably would have been fine as the more solid 70mm timber battens all the way up as looking around my well established suburb its a bit of a free-for-all anyway. I doubt I'll ever bother replacing anything but I do wonder whether I should have just stuck with the 70mm.  
The short side fence (length not height, its still 1200mm) is probably the best work and how it was meant to look. The front is a bit more "on the fly" as the levels have adapted to the uneven wall below. 
So with all my whinging out the way (I am a pom) - give me your thoughts!

----------

