# Forum Home Renovation Electrical  Isolating Switch for Room Heater

## chalkyt

This question relates to interpretation of AS3000, so it gets a bit "techy" and you need to know your way around AS3000. 
The installation of most room heaters comply with 4.9.1 in that they are usually plugged into a GPO and so "have an individual isolating switch". In holiday dwellings it is desirable for such heaters to be permanently connected... so far so good, simply connect via a cord grip  and switch instead of a 3 pin outlet. 
However, many owners ask for some sort of timer which turns the heater off after some period of time (guests do go out and leave heaters on all day) and this can be where interpretation of AS3000 becomes a bit messy (a common problem with A3000). Typically such a timer would be something like a Clipsal VETR3.(i.e. press the button and the heater is turned on for a set time period, or press the button again to turn it off). This makes it a "functional switch". 
Although the VETR3 type timer clearly is a "functional switch" *is it also an isolation switch?* (it does connect and disconnect via an internal relay when the button is pressed and so isn't a solid-state device which is prohibited as an isolation switch). According to 4.9.2, isolating switches should have a definite 'OFF' position (the VETR3 sort of complies because a red light is on when the contacts are closed and off when the contacts are open). 
Clause 2.3.2.2 infers that a circuit breaker at the board might be considered a "device for isolation". This is a bit vague but would solve the problem. 
So, the reason for all this waffle is that the simple way to control the duration of heater is to replace a GPO with a VETR3 plus a separate single gang wall plate with a cord grip for the heater connection (the VETR3 fills the GPO space with no room for anything else). The more complicated version has a two gang wall plate incorporating a cord grip and separate on-off switch mechanism which definitely is an isolation switch. Intuitively this version is a bit belt-braces-safety pins and looks like a Cape Canaveral control panel in that the heater can be turned off at three switches (the wall plate, the VETR3, and the switch on the heater... Arrrgh!). 
At the end of the day it probably doesn't matter all that much but in my mind, the simpler the better. The ultimate would be a 2 gang plate with a CABAC 3 wire timer and cord grip but unfortunately the CABAC only switches 5 A (the VETR3 handles 10A) and so the CABAC is no good for a 2400W heater. 
Sorry to post something so long winded, but "learned" opinions are welcome Your Honour.  Clipsal VETR32    CABAC 3 Wire timer (fits into a switch mech space)

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## PaulDW

Not a sparky but AFAIK most switches are just functional switches relying on the breaker to do isolation  so your two arrangements are similar.

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## Bart1080

Why not go down the path of a full remote control power point? 
Many known brands do it but as an example https://www.bunnings.com.au/deta-gri...point_p0098813
It is remote controllable on your phone via hoe wifi connection from anywhere, timer, & countdown timer, scheduled timer,  Use with the Grid Connect app, Google Assistant and Amazon Alexa from anywhere 
Simplifies it to just a PP changeover at the wall handling your 10A but needs Wifi connection and app download.

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## John2b

My experience with Apps is they frequently break when the host operating system is updated, then you lose functionality until the third party developer updates their App to the new OS - if they haven't gone out of existence in the meantime. I have more broken Apps on my phone than working ones - bloody useless IMHO. The last thing I ever want to do is run some remote technology from my phone FFS!

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## wozzzzza

> My experience with Apps is they frequently break when the host operating system is updated, then you lose functionality until the third party developer updates their App to the new OS - if they haven't gone out of existence in the meantime. I have more broken Apps on my phone than working ones - bloody useless IMHO. The last thing I ever want to do is run some remote technology from my phone FFS!

   have to agree.

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## FrodoOne

AS/NZS 3000 4.4.4.1 States : -
"Each socket-outlet shall be individually controlled by a separate switch which complies with either AS/NZS 3133 or AS 60947.3 ....."  https://www.cabac.com.au/p/lighting/...imers/hns440tm "Specifications" state
"Certification Standard: CISPR15, AS/NZS 3100, AS/NZS 60669.2.1 - neither of which is one of the above in AS/NZS 3000. - and, it will only switch up to 5 A. 
I have not been able to find Clipsal VETR 32.
However, Clipsal VETR31 does not list its "Certification" in its "specification" - so who knows?  
It would be easy enough to include *both* a "timer" and a "supply-disconnect" switch in the same wall plate. 
However, if you "connect via a cord grip and 10 A timer *instead* of a 3 pin outlet", there should be no problem in using the 10 A timer in the same (or nearby) wall-plate, since the "Circuit Breaker" will provide isolation, in accord with Clause 2.3.2.2

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