# Forum Home Renovation Stairs, Steps and Ramps  internal stair squeaks

## aerobar900

Hello all, 
I have recently had a tradie around to repair some internal stairs as they were quite noisy.
He glued the back of them and cut some wedges to go in behind them to fill the gap where the wood had shrunk but they are starting to get noisy again. 
I was advised that the stairs were never glued when they were put together and that to cure them correctly they would need to be dis-assembled, glued and re-assembled. 
Is this the only way to correct this problem? 
Thanks.

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## wizard

Hi, do you have easy access under the stairs? If you do some gluing and screwing in the under the stairs area is it going to be visible ? have you tried to find exactly what part is squeaking? I had this problem and used a long handled screwdriver with my ear to the handle touching differnt parts as somebody walked up and down the stairs pushing in different places to identify the exact spot. Then pushed upwards and sidewards while somebody made it squeak to try to see what direction to put in screws and glue to stop the squeaks. It took time and patience but it worked. This may not help you if you dont have the access or you dont want holes and screws visible.
Cheers

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## aerobar900

Thanks for your reply Wizard, 
There is plenty of access under the stairs. 
All of the steps have been glued at the back and 4 screws put in each step.
They don't squeak as much but they do still make some noise. 
I guess my concern was that they may not have been put together very well and no amount of adjusting behind the stairs is really going to fix it? 
I'm not really sure.

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## wizard

Even if they are not put together well you should be able to stop the squeaking. Is the noise coming from the join between the riser and the tread where your toes would be if you walked up the stairs AND/OR from the join between the front of the step (where the nosing is) and the top of the riser AND/OR is it coming from the edges of the treads or risers. Glue screws and perhaps 20mm by 20mm kdhw strips drilled and screwed could be fitted in these places to stop any movement. I had to do all of these to stop ours squeaking and it has worked for 7 years. I am sorry to go on so much but it should be possible to fix.
Cheers

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## shellac

No Nails did the trick for me. Got the glue gun into every gap I could see.(front and back) Worked a treat,some of the steps didnt even have wedges.
cheers

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## Larry McCully

Howdy. In most cases the tread butts up against the riser and a nail is driven in at points along the riser into the tread at the rear of the tread under the staircase.. This is all done during the assembly of the stair case at time of installation. . In some cases, the stair case components shrink as the years progress. This is caused by a few reasons. Mostly because the timber had a higher moisture content in it than the atmosphere in the house, and as over a period of time it drys out according to the relitive humidity. It is call EMC or equibilibrium moisture content. The noise you hear is most likley coming from the nail that is attaching the riser to the back of the tread. As you walk on the tread it is flexing and the nail that is penertrating through the riser is loose in the tread and it rubs in and out of the tread causing friction and a viibration that creates a sound wave , and thats what you hear.  To fix it is easy. Glue wont help much by itself. But you need to get under the stair case an inspect each riser at the tread conection. It is a simple matter of fixing a 25mm or 30mm screw along side at the entry point where the nails are. You will see mabe 3 or 4 nils attaching the riser to the tread. You can help secure it by squirting in a good quality pva glue at the same time you screw it tight. What will happen is as you screw through the riser into the tread, you will tighten the join at that point and you will most likley clear the squeek. You will need to do this with every tread. A good idea is to redrill through the riser with a drill slightly smaller than the screw you are going to use. This will stop the riser from splitting at the edge. You also need to screw in the fastener at mid point into the tread. You dont want the screw to penertrate through the top of the tread. Try it and see if it works.

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## Compleat Amateu

I love the way just ploughing through the forum can produce MORE handyman jobs, yep, I got squeaking stairs too .... not critical, but annoying. 
Larry, I don't follow what you are saying, maybe I'm missing something.  I have good access underneath my stairs, just had a look.  Each stair tread seems to be attached to the riser with 3-4 nails hammered diagonally upwards from the underside of the tread into the riser, i.e. from the inside towards the outside.  This seems to be the opposite of what you are saying :Confused:

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## Larry McCully

That is correct . In your case they have nailed through the tread into the riser. as you walk on the tread it is riding on the nail , and that will cause the squeek

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## Compleat Amateu

So, Larry, the silencing screws are fixed about 5 degrees above horizontal through the tread into the riser? 
Having this afternoon broken one tile from a drummy set of 70's tiles in a shower patchup, 'zer vil be other priorities zis week' - or somesuch! 
Thanks 
Compleat Amateur

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## Larry McCully

That is possible to do , however i would enter through the riser at a parallel position and into the back edge of the tread. The other way _could_ cause a fracture of the edge of the tread and it wont be as effective. Going in parrallel would have a more effective tightening power. A screw inserted at a skew angle is not as effective.

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## Compleat Amateu

Jeez Larry, I'm thick but I don't get it.  Do you mean a single horizontal screw going through the riser (outside to inside) penetrating the tread at an angle (i.e. not parallel to the grain, maybe 45 degrees to it). 
Otherwise what? 
Sorry for being slow ...

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## Larry McCully

Here is a detail for you to follow

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## Compleat Amateu

Thanks Larry, so screwing into endgrain of the tread (through the riser) is OK?  That works? 
Thanks mate 
Compleat

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## Larry McCully

Sure, timber is one of the most versatile substrates ever created.However caution and common sense needs to be taken if the width of any end grain fixing is insufficient to withstand splitting. in that case a pilot hole needs to be drilled first to take the pressure of the insertion, but still allow the screw to cut a thread into the walls of the screw path. Rule of thumb is to predrill a hole the size of the screw shank not the screw width. this will allow the screw to cut a path into the timber. However saying that, the tread on your step is not end grain butting up against the riser , but face grain. In stair construction, they cut the tread so that the grain runs in the direction from stringer to stringer.

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