# Forum More Stuff At the end of the day  Nude photos

## PlatypusGardens

Well not quite.       
Went and had some X-rays the other day as the chiro adjustments aren't doing what they should.
And the results are in. 
Arthritis, and lots of it.
In the spine, hip and pelvis and then some.
Goes back 10 years or more they reckon.
Could be genetic, could be...whatver.  
At 41 I'm a bit on the young side for such things, but there you go...   :No:    
Off to have a chat on Friday and see what natural remedies there are before going full pharmaceutical.    
Oh and apparently the dark spots in the X-rays are gas   :Shock:    
Ah well, it is what it is and it will probably be a long road to get on top of it, but no point dwelling on it.  :Smilie:

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## Marc

Bummer PG, that's not very encouraging ... Fish oil and Glucosamine usually helps. Change of diet too. 
Thy are finding new ways to combat arthritis all the time ... did they say osteo arthritis or rheumatoid arthritis?

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## OBBob

Not good. My wife is waiting / hoping for this to be pushed through sooner rather than later (she's had it since a teenager). All the best looking after it.   Breakthrough arthritis treatment developed by University of Queensland researchers - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

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## CraigandKate

Not good mate, at least you have a chance to get on top of it! x2 on fishoil and glucosamine, I am a big advocate for natural remedies, our bodies want to be healthy! Just have to give them the right building materials, Tumeric is a great anti inflammatory also, and consider avoiding wheat/processed foods as much as possible.

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## PlatypusGardens

> Bummer PG, that's not very encouraging ... Fish oil and Glucosamine usually helps. Change of diet too. 
> Thy are finding new ways to combat arthritis all the time ... did they say osteo arthritis or rheumatoid arthritis?

  Yeh I eat well, lots of everything.
Well, lots of the good stuff I should say.
My partner is gluten free/paleo as it worksa lot better for her so I'm pretty much the same.
I do love my eggs on toast from time to time though. 
Don't eat much processed food, have almost given up dairy completely and seek out the finest grassfed organic meats.   :Smilie:    
Dunno what specific kind, will probably find out on Fri.     

> Not good. My wife is waiting / hoping for this to be pushed through sooner rather than later (she's had it since a teenager). All the best looking after it.   Breakthrough arthritis treatment developed by University of Queensland researchers - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

  
Thanks. 
Interesting link.   :Smilie:

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## phild01

Bummer!
 At least you have the weather on your side for this if warm weather helps.  
..now what about the pics you lured me here for :Biggrin:

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## enasni

Cissus helps for some too.

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## SilentButDeadly

Our old dog has begun taking 4cyte in an attempt to offset inflamed joints... Vet Products Direct Australia - 4cyte Canine 100g 
You never know!

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## CraigandKate

Hahaha this old family friend of ours with a dodgy knee used to swear by this rub meant for racehorses always said "if its good enough for a multi million dollar racehorse its good enough for me"

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## PlatypusGardens

> ..now what about the pics you lured me here for

  
haha      

> Cissus helps for some too.

  
Hugs and cissus?    

> Our old dog has begun taking 4cyte in an attempt to offset inflamed joints... Vet Products Direct Australia - 4cyte Canine 100g 
> You never know!

  
Heh. 
Yeah our old mutt goes in for monthly Cartrofen injections.
Might see if they'll slip me a shot too while I'm in there    :Wink:

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## METRIX

Bummer,

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## PhilT2

Up to you what you spend your money on but glucosamine doesn't do well in properly run clinical trials Effects of glucosamine, chondroitin, or placebo in patients with osteoarthritis of hip or knee: network meta-analysis | The BMJ
Working with families who have kids with disabilities, I have seen a lot of people ripped off by "alternative" therapies so i have a bit of a bias against anything that hasn't been independently tested. Try what you want to try; just keep your hand on your wallet around people selling miracle cures.

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## METRIX



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## PlatypusGardens



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## ringtail

Bugger PG. Fish oil and lots of it. 5000 mg a day at least. Might need a few push ups to burn some calories off though  :Tongue:  . I've got bad osteo in my neck and god knows where else. I think if I stopped working I'd turn into a cripple. Keep movin' mate.

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## PlatypusGardens

Haha Metrix 
Yeh ringtail, I've never be one to laze on the couch. (Until after dark anyway)
Always moving.   :Smilie:

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## OBBob



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## PlatypusGardens

Is this what you dilute the snake oil with....?

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## ringtail

Bwahahahahaha

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## METRIX

The word CURE was a lot more liberal in the old days, than it is now, probably how the US became so addicted with suing everyone.
And only $15 to cure your rupture - Bargain, the Pepto Cocania just looks creepy. 
PP Perhaps drop by your local Wizard on yor way to work and get a packet of ANTI FAT, and a bottle of Electromagnetic Bathing Fluid, don't forget a tin of rheumatoid cure.
While your their get an Asthma, liver and bladder cure, oh and one of those bottles of cocaine drops, for dinner feed your kids and babies beer, it's good for them,

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## PlatypusGardens

Bile beans

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## Marc

The history of medicine is a colourful one. A mixture of trial and error arrogance and commercial interests ... not much different from today. 
The natural or alternative remedies from today fortunately have little relation with the cocaine digestives and the snake oil of the past.  
When it is a popular catchphrase to label what we don't know as snake oil, and when it is true that a lot of nutritional supplements lack the quality needed to produce the advertised effect, it is also true that doctors have ridiculed the use of supplements for decades calling them expensive urine makers. 
Today, after decades of making a fool of themselves, serious trials proved time and time again, the value of a myriad of different products for preventative medicine. 
There is no magic bullet for arthritis just yet however natural or alternative remedies, have made inroads despite the resistance from doctors and pharmaceutical companies. 
And I don't have to list the thousands of official approved proven treatments that turned out to be poison. Thalidomide anyone? What about Hysteria treatment?  
it is all about the money and nothing else. In Europe not long ago the European parliament attempted to pass legislation to dictate that all nutritional supplements needed to be prescribed by a GP. It was only the prompt reaction from the public that sent millions of emails to the parliament shutting their computers down for days that prevented this piece of nazi legislation to pass by the most corrupt parliament in the world.

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## phild01

Has anything really changed considering claims made by natural therapies, remedies and supplements on offer today.
Much of this marketing is so dependent on rubbish testimonials, not undisputed medical evidence.

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## Marc

Actually yes. The ease of obtaining information has created the need for better and more open trials in order to sell a product. There are of course many not so good product around, but today it would be impossible to dish out the equivalent of hysteria treatment, Insulin shock therapy or similar iatrogenesis. 
Products that relay on individual testimony are probably the worst of them all. What are they? Cure for baldness? magic weight loss? I got rid of Psoriasis in a week?... and similar stuff. 
Today you can research serious trials conducted by large organisations that compete with the allopathic medicine on equal footage. It is up to us the consumer to do the legwork. And most importantly do it without bias or misconceptions.

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## PlatypusGardens

I'm gonna build one of these.      :Biggrin:

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## Bros

The access to information now puts the doctors out of the realm of "Doctor knows best" and the older doctors hate the patient getting other sources of information and questioning them about it. I had that once and I never went back to him but went elsewhere.
When I am prescribed medication I look up the Internet to find the dosage and side effects as the literature that comes with medication is written in such small type you need a microscope to read it. On one Occassion my wife was prescribed some medication and the dosage was 1000mg which I thought was high so back to the doctor and much apology it should have been 100mg.
I also suffer from BPPV at times and I went to the specialist and he put me through some horrendous exercises and he said go home and look up Epley manoeuvre and do that until the symptoms go away, which I have done on a couple of occasions.

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## Marc

No need to build it, you can buy magnetic belts ready made. 
Magnets and copper bracelets are probably the most discredited form of "alternative" remedies, yet surprisingly no serious study have been done to support or discredit it. 
Another severely discredited form of medicine is homeopathy. Serious trials have dismissed the ones popular homeopathy as pure quackery, however ... the queen of England, a person that has all the information at her disposal not to mention money, has her own personal homeopathic doctor on staff.

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## Marc

Yes, Dr Google is a two edged sword. But it is not good information that would irritate a GP but bad information like the no vaccine mob or the "give me antibiotics" or "Need an X ray" type of patients my wife complains about the most.

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## OBBob

> I'm gonna build one of these.

   welder?

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## PlatypusGardens

> Yes, Dr Google is a two edged sword. But it is not good information that would irritate a GP but bad information like the no vaccine mob or the "give me antibiotics" or "Need an X ray" type of patients my wife complains about the most.

  Haha not just Doctor Google - *Doctor Everyone.*
Every man and his dog has been telling me to eat this and drink that, do yoga, tai-chi, meditate, wear crystals, sleep hanging upside down, etc etc etc over the past few days.  
While some of it might be sound advice, I'll speak to my chiropractor and GP and see what they recommend based on my condition and circumstances.   :Smilie:

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## Bros

> Yes, Dr Google is a two edged sword. But it is not good information that would irritate a GP but bad information

  I am aware of the fact Dr Google could be bad but in my case the Dr gave me three options for treatment and I choose one that I was happy with even though it was on his list of options. I went to another and he was fine with the way I went. 
I don't blindly follow doctors orders nor Dr Google but I make an informed choice. I have been away and came back with a cold and my daughter said go to the Dr and get some antibiotics I said no way as antibiotics are a waste of time for a virus so I ended up getting over it. 
I don't go to homopaths but many do and get better weather it is a mental thing or physical I don't know.

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## Marc

Yes, the internet give us a larger pool of choices. 
And usually recommendations from friends and family about alternative treatments are well intentioned and at worst, harmless.  
After all, the so much maligned placebo effect is an important part of any treatment. Two identical treatment one by a sympathetic doctor and another by an aggro arrogant person can have different results mainly to do with ... placebo.

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## Marc

> Haha not just Doctor Google - *Doctor Everyone.*
> Every man and his dog has been telling me to eat this and drink that, do yoga, tai-chi, meditate, wear crystals, sleep hanging upside down, etc etc etc over the past few days.  
> While some of it might be sound advice, I'll speak to my chiropractor and GP and see what they recommend based on my condition and circumstances.

  So PG, have you gone vegetarian, started yoga, and get massages with horse liniment? 
Funny you mention chiropractor, some of them are the worst offenders when it comes to claims. There is a guy on 2GB or is it 2UE? that can cure almost everything from dandruff to constipation, cholesterol, hygh blood pressure, low blood pressure, flat foot, and tinea to name a few ...  :Smilie:

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## Bros

> There is a guy on 2GB or is it 2UE? that can cure almost everything from dandruff to constipation, cholesterol, hygh blood pressure, low blood pressure, flat foot, and tinea to name a few ...

  Is that Dr Alan Jones? :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## PlatypusGardens

> Funny you mention chiropractor, some of them are the worst offenders when it comes to claims.  
> There is a guy on 2GB or is it 2UE? that can cure almost everything from dandruff to constipation, cholesterol, hygh blood pressure, low blood pressure, flat foot, and tinea to name a few ...

  My chiro is good. 
Has a background in nursing, operating theaters, ostheo, teaches yoga and is very much in to natural remedies when applicable.
And she's very thorough.  
But I'm sure as with any profession there's lots of money-grabbers out there.   :Smilie:

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## PhilT2

It's not the individual practitioners that are the core issue; it's the science behind what they do. Chiropractic and homeopathic have no verifiable science on which they base their practices.

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## METRIX

> I'm gonna build one of these.

  Same crap - Modern Version

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## phild01

...but it is clinically proven :Shock: .

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## Marc

> Is that Dr Alan Jones?

   Ha ha, no way, he GIVES you dandruff and tinea from worrying about EVERYTHING haha 
PG, I am sure he/she is. My daughter goes to a chiro all the time to fix her up because she is in BJJ and gets all her back out of joint.
I prefer the Osteopath. Besides the wild claims the Chiro are known for, they also do way too many unnecessary Xray. The Osteo does not. 
I wasted thousands on physiotherapy to fix a pain in one knee. I went to see an Osteo just to please one of my daughters and he fixed the problem in one session. it has nothing to do with the knee and everything to do with my back that was out.  
PhilT2, "verifiable science" sounds a lot like a multinational pharmaceutical company protecting their business. I would say that we still do not know today how this techniques work when they work and there is plenty of demonstrable evidence that they do, conceded not all the time.  
Someone that can fix a problem by manipulation or can diagnose a problem by mapping your iris is a threat to a trillions of dollars industry and must be discredited at all cost. 
It's easy to dismiss everything we do not understand, Chiro, Osteo, homeophaty, acupuncture, iridiology they are all empirical schools based on observation without explanation. 
i wouldn't venture in dismissing everything. The one school doctors and insurance companies recognise as valid is physiotherapy yet the funny thing is that physiotherapy is based on different ways to increase blood circulation using machines. Sort of a glorified massage. And then every Physiotherapist uses Chiro and Osteo techniques, so what is the go?

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## PlatypusGardens

> It's not the individual practitioners that are the core issue; it's the science behind what they do. Chiropractic and homeopathic have no verifiable science on which they base their practices.

  
I'll give Alan Jones a call later and see what he reckons then

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## GeoffW1

What a great thread

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## PhilT2

> PhilT2, "verifiable science" sounds a lot like a multinational pharmaceutical company protecting their business.

  No' verifiable science is just what it says it is; science that has been verified by being tested by an independent authority. A pharmaceutical company that tests its own products could never be considered unbiased nor should they be allowed to provide the funding for "independent" research. This is all basic stuff and is the reason we have disclosure rules where the authors of research papers have to disclose their sources of funding. 
No system is perfect and conventional medicine has its share of issues. But at least there is a system in place and some form of accountability. Doctors who promote quack cures have a chance of being pulled into line and having their ticket cancelled if they persist. Not so with chiros, homeopaths or naturopaths. They are out there still claiming to cure anything from autism to zits without any expertise, testing or regulation.

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## PlatypusGardens

> chiros, homeopaths or naturopaths are out there still claiming to cure anything from autism to zits

  They do? 
Didn't know that.   :Confused:

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## PhilT2

If you want to compare techniques used in chiro and medicine try and find a real doctor that does the neck manipulation favoured by chiros. You won't find one because doctors study anatomy and know this technique can cause a rupture of blood vessels in the brain stem resulting in a stroke or death.   https://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org...-manipulation/ 
Sorry if I'm having a rant but I've seen so many people ripped off. Let's get back to the nude pics; can I put my latest prostate ultrasound up? Maybe not...
Let's have a little Tim Minchen instead  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrgFIlnmrGk

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## PlatypusGardens

> What a great thread

  Just a bunch of people having opinions.   :Smilie:

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## PhilT2

> They do? 
> Didn't know that.

  Try Google  Chiropractic Adjustments Shown to Reverse Autism in Three-Year Old Girl - The Paleo Mama 
I don't have any qualifications in the field but i do have a daughter and cousin with autism and have followed the research for about 30 years. We participated in the research by the world Health Organisation into the genetic links in autism. We have also been involved with the University of Qld research into autism. I know where the experts in the field stand with regards to the effectiveness of chiro. I know a number of families who have tried chiro and years later their child is no better off. The chiros still want to take their money despite producing no results. Exploiting vunerable parents who are desperate to help their child is a low point few reach.

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## Marc

Yes, there are lots of different opinions on the subject. 
Manipulation can produce a stroke? Sure, and so can warfarine yet it is prescribed by the millions.
I did mention some wild claims from some Chiro, yet I wouldn't tarnish them all with the same brush ...
 My wife dislikes them with a passion though ...
It is venturous at best to dismiss what we don't know. Even more if it is something that no one claims to know only that it works ... sometimes.  
Having 5 doctors and one physiotherapist in my immediate family I am usually a bit dismissive of specialist that pontificate on something so when I went for a routine check with a cardiologist who asked me if I was taking any medication since he couldn't find anything wrong with me. I told him I was taking multivitamins and fish oil. 
He shook his head with piti saying matter of fact "why do people take stuff that is not PROOVEN" ... to what I replied ... what do you suggest? He passed to tell me to take "mumbojumbo" that had passed test and proven to work. 
I got a bagful of samples at home so when I checked HIS magic bullet, it turned out to be ... fish oil ! Ha ha and not even a good quality one, no test for mercury.

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## PlatypusGardens

Well 
I went to the chiro to see what was going on with my leg pain.
Her initial assessment was rotated pelvis. 
It all added up too, my legs were differnt length when laying down, the nerve pain in question should have been caused by it.
She had a crack (pun intended) and it got a bit better.
Didn't wanna try and force it so said "see how it goes and come when/if you want." 
Went for another 3 visits and it gradually got better, then back to where it started again.
She established that it must be somthing else, even though it all seemed to be what she initially thought. 
Hence the X-rays, and now we know what's going on.   :Smilie:

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## PhilT2

[QUOTE=Marc;979563Manipulation can produce a stroke? Sure, and so can warfarine yet it is prescribed by the millions.[/QUOTE] 
this illustrates the point I made earlier. Warfarin is used in critical care for people who already have serious issues. It is used to prevent clotting in people who have heart surgery among other things so is part of the overall treatment needed to keep people with heart disease alive. It has side effects as most medications do but the alternative for people who have had heart surgery is worse. Neck manipulation has no science behind it and has never been tested as a cure for anything so there is no positive effect in its use. 
It may have taken time but the medical profession eventually recognised the problem and took steps to minimise the issues. Chiros are still doing neck manipulations. I've never heard of one warning a client of possible side effects.

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## PlatypusGardens

Hah  
I thought it said "so can warfare" at first.

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## PlatypusGardens

Anyway I'm off to catch some snakes.  
How do you get the oil out of them?   :Confused:

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## phild01

> Anyway I'm off to catch some snakes.  
> How do you get the oil out of them?

   :Laugh bounce:

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## Marc

You can convert you bending press into an oil press. Easy mod ... *Snake Oil: A Guide for Connoisseurs*   *Investigative Files**Joe Nickell**Skeptical Briefs Volume 16.3, September 2006* In an earlier article, “Peddling Snake Oil” (Nickell 1998), I addressed the question of snake oil’s existence. At least one source had asserted: “There is no such thing as snakeoil, though many thousands of bottles containing stuff called snakeoil were sold to gullible patrons of carnival sideshows in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries” (Morris and Morris 1988). Actually, real snake oil was prized for its reputed medicinal properties. However, those were modest compared to the claims of later cure-alls sold under the name “snake oil.” Here is an attempt to trace the evolution of both the product and its labeling-with examples from my personal collection (see figure 1). *Snake Hunters*Some Native Americans, including the Choctaws, reportedly treated rheumatism and other ills with applications of rattlesnake grease. The practice appears to have been copied by pioneers. In 1880, a newspaper article on a Pennsylvania man-described as “a celebrated hunter, trapper and snake-tamer by the name of John Geer”-told how he killed rattlesnakes and extracted “oil from their bodies.” The article noted: “this oil is very usable and sells readily for $1 per ounce. It is said to have great curative powers” (“Killing Snakes” 1980). Such a snake hunter was Peter “Rattlesnake Pete” Gruber (1858-1932) who operated a saloon and museum of curiosities in Rochester, New York. As shown in a rare photograph in my collection, he wore a snakeskin tie and coat, the latter studded with snake heads, and he sported a serpentine walking stick. He claimed an old Indian woman taught him to take out the rattlesnake fat and extract the oil to cure such ailments as rheumatism, stiff joints, carbuncles, boils, and earache. The snakes’ tissue-like outer skin was also used for poultices (Merrill 1952, 22, 27). Another such hunter was Will “Rattlesnake Willie” Clark of Bolton, New York. According to a local tale (Lord 1999, 96): Once he stopped at a pub to “wet his whistle” after a long day collecting snakes on Tongue Mountain. While he was imbibing, someone untied the burlap bag he had placed his captives in during the day. Suddenly cries of surprise and fear rose above the din of the bar-room as the snakes were noticed by the patrons. Willie immediately captured the half dozen escaping reptiles and returned them to the sack. The clients became very concerned, however, when old Willie admitted he could not remember if he had taken 6 or 7 of the crawling critters from the hills that afternoon. For the rest of the week the bartender kept a loaded shotgun behind the bar and visitors to the establishment carried forked sticks about with them whenever they went into the groggery.There were many other snake hunters. In my collection is a Schoolcraft, Michigan, vendor’s license of May 26, 1881, permitting an otherwise unidentified “Snake Man” to “sell oil” for two days. I also have a 1906 postcard picturing one Abe Minckler of Kellam, Pennsylvania, a “Dealer in Snakes, Snake Skins, and Snake Oils.” *Snake Oils*The original snake hunters metamorphed into the later medicine-show pitchmen and other vendors of “patent” medicines. (A relative few of the ready-made nostrums were actually patented, since that required disclosure of their ingredients. Instead they merely had their brand names registered.) From a decade of collecting antique “snake oil” bottles, I have identified no fewer than seven types, as follows:  *Genuine snake oil.* This appears to have been sold largely by local suppliers. I have a copy of an entry for “snake oil” that appeared in an 1830s store ledger; one ounce sold for twenty-five cents. I also once saw in a private collection an old blue-glass bottle with a label on which was penned “Snake Oil.” As I recall, it appeared to date from the mid-nineteenth century.*Liniment containing snake oil as an ingredient.* Perhaps the most famous brand of this type was Clark Stanley’s Snake-Oil Liniment. Dressed in western attire and calling himself “The Rattlesnake King,” Stanley is said to have held crowds spellbound (figure 2). In 1893, at the World’s Columbian Exposition in Chicago, he slaughtered rattlers by the hundreds and processed the juices to make his cure-all. Its label noted it was for external use only and claimed it “Relieves the Pain of Muscular Rheumatism, Lame Back, Contracted Muscles, Sprains, Bruises, Corns, Chilblains, Frostbites, and Bites of Most Insects” (Fowler 1997, vi, 10-12). In 1917 (ten years after the federal Food and Drug Act became law) samples of Stanley’s liniment were federally seized and tested. They were revealed to be mostly mineral oil containing about one percent fatty oil (thought to have been beef fat), along with some red pepper (which would impart a soothing warmth to the skin) and possible traces of turpentine and camphor (Fowler 1997, 11-12). Among other liniments of this type was Blackhawk’s Liniment, sold by the Blackhawk Remedy Company of Baltimore. Its label pictured a pistol-packing, snake-vest wearing cowboy and boasted, “Positively Contains Rattle Snake Oil.” However, the label went on to state: “This product does not depend upon Rattle Snake Oil for its therapeutic effects.”*Snake oil in name only.* One specimen of this type was sold in a generic screw-top prescription bottle by C.F. Sams of Durham, N.C. Its label proclaims: “Old Fashioned Snake Oil. World’s Famous-Double Strength. Recommended For Corns, Bunions, Toothache, Head and Chest Colds, Sore Throat, Cuts and Bruises, Arthritis, Headache and Sore Feet.” Despite its name and rattlesnake illustration, however, its list of contents (“Mustard Oil, Pine Oil, Petroleum Oil, Paprika, Camphor Gum, Oil of Wintergreen”) does not include snake oil.*Liniment acknowledging former identity as “Snake Oil.”* Like type 3, this is clearly a transitional stage. An example is Miller’s Antiseptic Oil of 1916, sold by the Herb Juice Medicine Co. of Jackson, Tennessee. Its bottle was embossed, “Known as Snake Oil.” In 1929 it was restyled, the same bottle sporting a new paper label reading “Miller’s Anti-Pain Oil” and adding, “For Years Called Snake Oil But Does Not Contain Snake Oil.” Other examples of this type include one distributed by “Chief White Horse” of Madison, Wisconsin. The label reads, “Rub-in-Oil, that Famous Pioneer Liniment Formerly Known as Snake Oil.” Another was White Eagle’s Indian Oil Liniment whose label reads “Formerly called Rattlesnake Oil, the Old Indian Remedy for Rheumatism, Stiff Joints, Inflammation, Catarrh, Hay Fever.” Still another was Worner’s Famous Liniment of Phoenix, Arizona, whose label made no mention of snake oil but prominently pictured a wood engraving of a rattlesnake.*Liniments like snake oil but not advertised as such.* One of these was Dr. Thomas’ Eclectric (sic) Oil which became Excelsior Eclectric Oil (in 1880) and (still later) Dr. Thomas’ Eclectic (_sic_) Oil. Formulated by Dr. S.N. Thomas of Phelps, New York, Eclectric/Eclectic Oil contained “Spirits of Turpentine, Camphor, Oil of Tar, Red Thyme and Fish Oil specially processed.” Other examples of this type were Omega Oil and the ubiquitous Sloan’s Liniment (which I recall my maternal grandfather using)-both containing an extract of Capsicum (cayenne pepper).*“Snake Oil” as a pejorative for any of various cure-alls-tonics, especially, many containing alcohol.* These included Perry Davis’ Pain Killer (which became famous in the cholera epidemic of 1849), Lydia E. Pinkham’s Vegetable Compound (which transformed her into the most widely recognized American woman of her day), Swamp Root Kidney and Liver medicine (pitched by the Kickapoo Indian Medicine Company), and Dr. Pierce’s Golden Medical Discovery (which was promoted as “the best Cough Remedy, Blood Purifier, Anti-Bilious, or Liver Medicine and Tonic, or Strength Restorer, of the Age”). By extension, any worthless remedy-bottled or not-is sometimes referred to disparagingly as “snake oil.”*Satirically fake “snake oil.”* Generally modern, these spoofs on patent-medicine include “Dr. Jake Dawson’s Liniment Tonic” (now there is a contradiction in terms!), which is also billed as “Snake Oil” and “Hair Growing Tonic” promising “Immediate Relief.” (The label bears “stains” which-like the rest of it-were printed by the halftone-screen process.) Another of the genre is “Doc Wizzardz Original Snake Oil Elixir,” said to contain “Aged L.A. Tap Water.” Its label warns, “Danger: Not Fit for Human Consumption.” *Conclusion*_Figure 2. Clark “Rattlesnake King” Stanley entertained audiences by killing rattlers and processing the juices for his Snake Oil Liniment. Today his bottles and flyers are highly collectible. (Author’s collection. Photo by Tom Flynn.)_ Old-fashioned snake oil has largely disappeared. (One exception is a small bottle of Aceite de Culebra-snake oil-I picked up in Mexico. Sold as an “Emollient-For External Use Only,” it contains “cod liver oil and mineral oil.”) Although I cannot attest to the effectiveness of genuine rattlesnake oil, many of the snake-oil liniments of yesteryear no doubt provided some relief to aching muscles and certain other minor afflictions-much like today’s popular heat rubs and other topical medicines. But just as snake-oil liniments were eventually overtaken by outrageous cure-alls, so are today’s respectable over-the-counter medicines suffering unfair competition from various “alternative” treatments that range from the ineffective to the dangerous. In that sense, snake oil is not so much an outdated term but one that needs updating from time to time. *Acknowledgments*Rob McElroy helped find many of the snake-oil bottles in my collection. *References*Fowler, Gene, ed. 1997. Mystic Healers and Medicine Shows. Santa Fe, New Mexico: Ancient City Press.“Killing Snakes for a Living.” 1880. The Spectator (Hamilton, Ontario), August 7:3.Lord, Thomas Reeves. 1999. Still More Stories of Lake George: Fact and Fancy. Pemberton, N.J.: Pinelands Press.Merrill, Arch. 1952. Shadows on the Wall. Reprinted Interlaken, New York: Empire State Books, 1994, 19-30.Morris, William, and Mary Morris. 1988. Morris Dictionary of Word and Phrase Origin. 2nd ed. New York: Harper & Row, 535.Nickell, Joe. 1998. Peddling snake oil. Skeptical Briefs 8:4 (December), 1-2, 13.

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## Uncle Bob

PG's nude because all his clothes rotten away after playing with acid  :Biggrin:

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## goldie1

Gees PG thats a bummer. I have the dreaded osteo in two elbows and one hip. I'm with Ringtail keep 
 moving. If I sit down too long I end up like the tin man when he was caught in the rain. I find 
swimming a big help I go twice a week.

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## PlatypusGardens

Yeh I'm always doing something, not much of a couch sitter.   :Smilie:  
Thankfully working in the shed is the best thing for it.
Lots of upper body movement, standing on solid ground.  
Driving is a killer though

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## Marc

> PG's nude because all his clothes rotten away after playing with acid

   Oh ... that is what those black spots are? Gee PG be more careful next time you are full of holes! :Shock:

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## goldie1

> Yeh I'm always doing something, not much of a couch sitter.   
> Thankfully working in the shed is the best thing for it.
> Lots of upper body movement, standing on solid ground.  
> Driving is a killer though

  Yeah I had a lot of probs driving. Doc had me on Celebrex   which worked well. Since I  took 
up regular swimming less of a prob and I  have given up the Celebrex

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## PlatypusGardens

> Oh ... that is what those black spots are? Gee PG be more careful next time you are full of holes!

  
Haha. 
It's gas, apparently...  
As for acid and holes, I finally washed those pants, no problems, not a single hole   
yet

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## Uncle Bob

> As for acid and holes, I finally washed those pants, no problems, not a single hole   
> yet

  The old pants might be alright then, usually with strong enough hydrochloric acid they get converted to dust before your eyes.

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## Marc

yes, yes, I knew it was gas hu hu everyone farts sometimes ... well not the ladies of course. 
By the way your jeans' integrity tells me the acid was rather weak. Not that you need a stronger one for the purpose. 
By the by ... and talking about home made remedies ... and considering that snake oil has such a good reputation ... what about getting a few snakes fat, then harvest the fat and make ... snake soap!
You wash yourself with snake soap and you get the benefit of snake oil plus get clean in the process ... win win situation ... now we can do this way ... you catch the snakes and get the fat, I cook the soap up, press it into soap bars and then we flog it on ebay 50-50 ... prrfect! 
PS
I have been in bed all week sick ... what is your excuse?

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## PlatypusGardens

> By the way your jeans' integrity tells me the acid was rather weak.

  dunno. 
These are the bottles.
Both used undiluted  
The pants aren't actual jeans BTW.

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## PlatypusGardens

Well, went and had a chat with the chiro.
She showed me on the X-rays what's going on and she can't for the life of her understand how I have not had any real problems until now.  
In broad terms: 
There's arthritis in the spine, hips, pelvis, everywhere.
My spine is out of alignment, parts of it is practically worn down to nothing and everything is generally out of whack.  
I need to get some MRI done to establish what is pinching the nerve which is causing the leg pain though.    :Sneaktongue:

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## Marc

Hum, sorry to hear that PG,

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## PlatypusGardens

Meh 
it is what it is.   
I'm too easy going (or dumb) to worry about it.    :Smilie:

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