# Forum Home Renovation Demolition  removing a section of wall in brick apartment

## rogerwilco

Hi, after months of hunting, we were finally successful buying an apartment at auction on the weekend! 
The building is a 1970s three story block of flats in brick construction.
we're on 1st floor with one floor above and parking underneath on ground floor. 
We want to remove a doorway and some adjoining wall in order to open up the small dining area into the living room. I assume that the internal wall construction is rendered brick (I guess it could be solid concrete too...) which means it's probably load bearing. 
As I understand it, if it is a LB wall, the process to remove the wall will probably involve:
- a structural engineer, who will assess the building, specify requirements and provide drawings for a builder
- a builder to carry out the work (likely with a structural beam of some sort)
- an inspection to confirm the work is carried out correctly
- approval from body corporate (based on engineer's report) 
The total area of wall we want to remove is approx 1800-2000mm across (inc. a standard door opening).  
So, based on what I know, I'm assuming this should be a fairly no-fuss job.
Can anyone give a ballpark on how much this may cost?
And, if you know a good structural engineer in Melbourne CBD, I'd love a recommendation. 
Thanks!

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## GraemeCook

Hi Rogerwilco 
You will probably also need approval of the body corporate of your units.   I might be worth having a coffee and a chat with the secretary of the body corporate and ask him/her the same questions.   Someone else may already have had similar alterations done and you could use the same engineer. 
On the other hand, some body corporates are dysfunctional and will oppose everything.  In this case it may simply be uneconomic to put in the doorway.    
[A friend has been caught in the crossfire of two warring unit owners: they oppose everything, disrupt all body corporate meetings, decline conciliation and have taken five suits against each other to the supreme court in the last five years - their collective lawyers bills have allegedly passed $500,000.   Nothing has been achieved.   Meanwhile the other unit owners can do little as there is always a legal case outstanding, which may affect them.]    A very difficult and unpleasant situation for everyone. 
Cheers 
Graeme

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## rogerwilco

thanks for that advice. 
Figured I'd need approval from body corporate.
Looking at the annual body corporate meeting minutes (from the section 32 statement), it looks like it's mostly owner/occupiers and they seem to be a pretty reasonable bunch.  
Wouldn't expect any major dramas and I'm already in touch with the owners' corporation's management. 
Any clue on total cost?

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## myla

hi, 
i reckon 10 grand (total, ie engineers, drawings, builder, work etc) 
thanks

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## rogerwilco

ok, a bit more than I was expecting... 
I was *guessing* more like: 
engineers assessment & drawings: $1500
builder's fee for removing existing wall, installing support beam according to engineer's spec and patching, rendering etc: $3000
building inspection and approvals: $1000 
that makes $5500. Then add $1000 for stuff that I don't know about... $7000 max. 
Why do you think it's $10,000? Do you know something I don't or is that a guess too?

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## Toothman

A friend of mine was recently telling me about someone in his family getting a brick wall opened up here in Sydney (not sure if it was structural or not) and they ended up spending about $6000. This was in a house though and no strata to worry about; not sure of any more details. 
Cheers,
Toothman

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## jimmythechippy

3000 for the builder = tell him he's dreaming... most builders wont get out of bed for that. there's actually quite a bit of work involved in what you are talking about even thou it seams to be a simple task. expecially considering the loads potentially involved.  
jimmy

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## tahna

We are in the middle of removing a load bearing wall in our brick house (opening up the kitchen/dining and loungerooms). The wall being removed covers 5 mtrs in length. The engineers visit/costs/plans being drawn up etc came to $525, the steel beam and associated rods/C Section/supports etc going in has cost approx $550, the builder is charging approx $1000 to do the job. Council approval cost approx. $150. We are doing the patchwork in the ceiling/floors painting etc to save on cost.  
I'd suggest you shop around, we're in south australia so maybe things are cheaper over here. (The most expensive quote we received to do the job was $4,500 all inclusive of materials, labour etc) but excluding the patchwork after if that makes sense.

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## rogerwilco

Thanks Tahna, that's helpful information. 
For anyone else following this thread, I just spoke with a good engineer - his total estimate (caveat being that he's not a builder) was closer to my original guess, he thinks it shouldn't cost more than $5-6k including:
- engineer's consultation and drawings
- materials for the beam 
- 1-5 days labour for 2 builders
- equipment hire etc
- permits etc

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## myla

hi, 
sorry for the delay rogerwilco, just going back over the figures i think it would probably head over the 10k mark, maybe by 1-2k 
you will most likely get posts and beams required in the engineering specs, temporary props required during construction, then enclosing steel/beams 
get some builders (licensed) around and see where it heads 
thanks

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## lau

Hi,
I'm looking into doing the exact same renovation to my 2 bedroom apartment in melbourne, I was wondering if you'd have any advice or suggestions regarding it. And I'm really curious to know how much it all cost in the end?
Cheers,
laura

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## PeteV

it all depends on the size of the opening, access, and what it is holding up...  
are you dealing with brick or concrete?
how big is the opening?
what is above the wall? (ie. is it load bearing?)
Have you got good access to get materials in and out?  
best advice is to speak to an engineer...
hope this helps!

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