# Forum Contacts & Links Estimating & Quoting  First time renovators!

## KBird82

Hey everyone, 
Newbie here! This will be our first renos, as long as the bank approves anyway lol! I'm scared, excited and daunted all at the same time lol! This is my to do list so far. If anyone could tell me roughly how much they'd allow it would be much appreciated. I understand that it's a hard ask but just after some opinions. I'm also struggling with where to start! Like I said this is all new to us.

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## sol381

Those emotions sound about right.. first find the biggest hammer you can and just start smashing things.. Your to do list is very short as well.. Maybe some detail on the reno and what you plan to do to the house in regards to adding or renovating certain rooms.

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## phild01

Strange, I can't see a to do list nor a link :Confused:

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## sol381

Maybe he has nothing to do..

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## KBird82

Sorry guys I forgot to paste the list in!  
To do list.  
•	Retaining wall (34 metres of timber sleepers that need to be replaced)
•	Cut all the trees down in front and back yard
•	Back steps and deck (4 steps)
•	Front steps and extend deck by approx 2 metres (5 steps) 
•	Clean garage out and put in storage/shelving 
•	Take down shed 
•	Kitchen 
•	Paint internal and external (3 bedrooms, lounge, kitchen, bathroom, toilet)
•	Rip up carpet and tiles install vinyl flooring (approx 46 Sq metres)
•	Remove wall between kitchen and lounge room (if possible)
•	Maybe remove wall in our bedroom
•	Re tile the toilet
•	Garage door???
•	Remove fire place
•	New front and back door
•	New linen cupboard door
•	Fix front window (sliding one so can be removed and repaired)
•	New appliances

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## toooldforthis

[S]    Cut all the trees down in front and back yard[/S]

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## KBird82

> [S]•    Cut all the trees down in front and back yard[/S]

  They aren't big trees. More like overgrown plants and weeds!

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## Spottiswoode

Of those, the kitchen sounds the most expensive - perhaps obviously. The others will really depend on how much work there is to do, and how much of that work you need to pass on to others. A lot of your list sounds labour intensive, but suited to DIY if you have some skills and are willing to do it. 
ive done a lot of work in our house, converting rooms, moving walls plastering and painting etc. I estimate it has cost $20k to date. In that was $5k for roof Windows and $3k for wardrobe doors. Everything else (except electrical) has been done by me. We probably have another $10k to do carpet and maybe $2k for a wardrobe fit out by professionals. 
I'm  not an estimator, but would not be surprised if a builder would have cost $50k-$60k to do the lot.

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## Marc

Top of the list ... shop for another house that does not need renovating and costs $50,000 more than yours. You will be years ahead and stress free.

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## Optimus

> Top of the list ... shop for another house that does not need renovating and costs $50,000 more than yours. You will be years ahead and stress free.

  Harsh...

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## phild01

But do factor in other costs like stamp duty, moving costs, solicitors fees, commissions etc.

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## Marc

But true. 
DIY renovating is a painful process that takes years, produces mediocre results and may affect your family and marriage, and worst of all, does not deliver nowhere near the financial results you expect. 
Yes you get some satisfaction from doing it yourself, if you can actually do it.... and you get systematically ripped off by third parties you contract to work for you. 
You live in a messy construction site for years, and when you have finished, if you ever finish, you don't want to move anymore. You invested too much in that house that now thinking of selling is painful. 
And so you stay ... for years. Until your 'renovations' are old and in need for another re renovation. If you sell, your amateurish game will be obvious and you will get a cut in your price. In the end, it was hardly worth it.
Sell and buy something better.

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## Bros

> Top of the list ... shop for another house that does not need renovating and costs $50,000 more than yours. You will be years ahead and stress free.

   There are a couple of old saying and one that comes to mind it is better to have the worst house in the best street than the best house in the worst street. Maybe the position suits the DIY renovator.
I live in an area which is fairly hilly and I paid a premium for a flat block but when I added the cost of retaining walls to sloping blocks it was close to the same price.

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## KBird82

I'm not wanting to buy something better. Even if that was the case there is still work that would need to be done to sell. I'm happy with this house. We just want to fix the dodgy work done by the previous owners and make the improvements we want that we haven't been able to until now.  
I am allowing between 50-60k to do what we are wanting to do. The most important is the retaining wall.

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## Marc

You are probably in the ballpark for the cost of what you want to do ... probably a bit short because of all the changes you will inevitably factor in.  
Everyone that wants to renovate is happy with the location, want's to fix up to sell, or fix the dodgy work the previous renovator has done, make capital improvements, wants to stay forever and many other all perfectly valid reasons. 
I just tell you what most people won't... that is...unless your are a professional builder or carpenter with lots of experience, are out of work and have an alternative source of income and a ton of tools, no kids or live alone and are between 20 and 30, renovating your own home is a bad idea and you are way better off moving houses. Like I said most folks will not venture the truth because most will have made the same mistake and hate admitting it.  :Smilie:  
I must have read 100 or more of post like this in the last 10 years easy. http://www.renovateforum.com/f205/re...9/#post1032413

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## KBird82

I appreciate your honesty Marc. That's why I'm trying to factor what we can do and what we need to get pros in for cause I don't want to be borrowing that amount of money and do nothing. And I want to do it properly and not dodge like last owners.

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## Marc

Well ... I got it the first time ... so yes, you are in the right place to get help with your renovation.

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## commodorenut

If you cost it up at $40K, borrow $60K.  Everything will blow out, but a 50% buffer should cover you.
Here's my thoughts on what to attempt yourself to save some cash: 
•	Retaining wall (34 metres of timber sleepers that need to be replaced) 
How high is this wall?  If it's only a few sleepers high, then it can be DIY, otherwise you'll need a reliable landscaper.
Check wth your council, as you may need to use an approved method of construction if it's over their height limit (some are 1m, others are dropping as low as 600mm these days) and have it signed off by an engineer - the engineer won't be required if you're doing like-for-like though. 
•	Cut all the trees down in front and back yard
If the trees are small, buy a mulcher and some good cutters, and you can  work your way through them over time - saving a lot compared to calling  in a pro.
You might then just need to call them in for stump  grinding on some of the larger ones, but try to work out garden beds  where you can hide those stumps - cutting them low, and let them rot in  the ground. 
•	Back steps and deck (4 steps)
From what you wrote in your kitchen thread, and the height of this, I think this is where you should get someone in - but read a bit of the deck section on here, and only use a decent, licenced guy.  There's a few on here in Brizzy that may put their hand up. 
•	Front steps and extend deck by approx 2 metres (5 steps) 
As above 
•	Clean garage out and put in storage/shelving 
Definitely a project for you guys to do yourself.  Don't fall for commercial solutions though - it'll cost a bomb.  
Scour Gumtree, Ebay and your local facebook groups for old cupboards & shelving solutions.  If you have the space, pallet racking is great.
Consider keeping some of the old kitchen for the garage as well. 
•	Take down shed 
Easy task for a weekend DIY. 
•	Kitchen 
See kitchen thread. 
•	Paint internal and external (3 bedrooms, lounge, kitchen, bathroom, toilet)
This is definitely something where you can save a lot of money.  
It will take a couple of weeks of evenings after work.  I did a 3 bedroom house in 4 days (incl gyprock repairs) but Friday night was an all-nighter so the tenants could start moving in the next day..... but I was only 1 person doing 10-12 hour days.  1 undercoat & 2 colour coats in each room.  Only 1 ceiling coat, as it was still good from the previous repaint (previous tenants were just "wall sliders" where every room was grubby on the walls, particularly the hallway).
Hardest part is cutting in, but consider using light colours in the bedrooms and painting the ceiling the same.  Otherwise, practice, and more practice! 
•	Rip up carpet and tiles install vinyl flooring (approx 46 Sq metres)
Hard to say what to do here - depends on the state of the floor under it. 
•	Remove wall between kitchen and lounge room (if possible)
See kitchen thread (good suggestions there about load-bearing). 
•	Maybe remove wall in our bedroom
How will that impact the house?  Will it reduce the space in other areas? 
•	Re tile the toilet
If you're willing to give it a go, this isn't too hard to DIY, but you'll need to invest in some tools.
Might have difficulty getting a pro tiler out for such a small job, so don't be tempted by a "handyman" type unless they can prove their quality of similar work with references you can check. 
•	Garage door???
Is the current one a roller?  If so you can DIY replace it with another roller.
If you want to change the type, you'll probably need to get the likes of B&D, Steel-line, Gliderol etc out to measure & quote. 
•	Remove fire place
Another DIY job if you have some spare roof tiles.  An easy gyrock repair for a beginner too. 
•	New front and back door
If you (or hubby) can use a chisel, you'll do a much better job than some big-name jingle-singing companies that pump out TV ads....
If not, then consider the same deck guy if he's good with doors too (again, check references/previous work). 
•	New linen cupboard door
As above. 
•	Fix front window (sliding one so can be removed and repaired)
If it's an aluminium frame, and the sliding bit is smashed, take it out (slide it into the open position and lift it out).  A local independent glazier will be able to change the glass over for a reasonable price (as an example, I recently did a 900mm x 600mm panel that was $50 cash on a saturday - but I had to take it to his workshop.  The call-out fee for a big name is more than that! 
•	New appliances
Big can of worms...... just the fixed ones in the kitchen, or other whitegoods too?
Probably the best place to start is browse the shops for models you like, and hit up the internet for reviews.
Choice have some really good comparisons.  Google their website, and maybe purchase a short-term subscription to assist your research.

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## KBird82

Thank you for your reply commodorenut. The retaining wall we'll probably have to pay someone to do it. It's about 800 high. Going to get hubby to ring around today and get a few people to come do quotes.  
The floor already has cement board underneath so I'm willing to help pull up the old floor then thinking of doing DIY vinyl flooring.  
The steps we should be able to just replace ourselves. They are just old and starting to rot.  
With the bedroom wall. On the other side is a walk in robe that doesn't get used! So the only impact will be on the WIR. 
Garage door is currently a tilt one which hasn't worked properly in the 7 years that we've been here! We've had to dyno bolt it closed to stay closed lol!  
My new favourite site has been Gumtree looking for building materials!  
I'm starting to re think the kitchen. Use the existing cupboards and get new doors and bench top to try and save some money. Will still need a few new things though

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## Craigoss

Good luck, be prepared for a long ride. I only just finished a full house reno of my first place. 8yrs DIY and about 250k in materials.

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## Spottiswoode

> Good luck, be prepared for a long ride. I only just finished a full house reno of my first place. 8yrs DIY and about 250k in materials.

  Don't tell Marc  :Shock:  
Time to get your hands dirty KBird!

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## cyclic

I noticed Cement Sheet,  
did anyone mention Asbestos Cement Sheet ?

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## KBird82

> I noticed Cement Sheet,  
> did anyone mention Asbestos Cement Sheet ?

  There's cement board underneath the carpet.

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