# Forum More Stuff Owner Builders Forum  Just a quick OB question

## breakerboy2000

On the qld building website it says for building or reno work with estimated costs above 11,000 an OB permit is required ,  but another statement I read was, a licenced contractor or builder is required for reno/building works above $3300, 
So really, if you want to do the work yourself you need to get an OB permit for anything above 3300? Whats with the 11000 rule?  
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## rod1949

Check with you local council / building authority is the most obvious answer.

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## ringtail

In a nutshell, 
one can claim OB status and do work on their own house if the works are COMMERCIALLY valued at $11k or less including GST. 
Unlicenced persons ( think handyman or hire a hubby types) cannot perform work more than $3300 including gst ( people doing it for a living, not homeowners) unless they are working for a person that holds the appropriate licence. ( like a builder employing an unlicenced chippy) 
OB permit IS required if the REAL WORLD value of the job is more than $11 k including GST 
OB permit IS required if you wish to supervise, direct, instruct trades regardless of work value 
NO insurance cover is available to OB's from trades. You have an issue, you are on your own  
dont confuse OB permits with building approval either. You will still need building approval, plans and certification for just about anything ( to do it by the book) so it's pretty hard to stay under the $11 k mark to claim OB status without a permit.

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## JB1

> NO insurance cover is available to OB's from trades. You have an issue, you are on your own

  True, but you're not going to get much help from an unscrupulous builder either. 
You can't claim via a builder's insurance unless the builder is insolvent or dead. 
Regardless of OBing or going through a builder, check for references.  
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## ringtail

No, not true. The QBCC ( QLD Building And construction commision) will go the builder on behalf of the customer if needed. That's the whole idea. Always use a licenced tradesperson and the QBCC will pursue the issue if it all turns ugly. Opt to become an owner builder on the other hand and QBCC doesn't want to know anything about you and your problems with trades. Up here all trades must have their own public / product liability insurance but the insurance money paid to the QBCC is separate and called statutory home warranty insurance. If a builder or trade goes broke, dies etc.... The QBCC will appoint a new builder/ tradie to take over or rectify, whatever the case may be - at no expense to the home owner. The OB on the other hand would have to bring a civil case against the builder/ tradie. The builders/ tradies normal insurances will take effect in the case of a liability claim. As far as claiming on the builders insurance, well, thats why we pay house and contents insurance. Whoever you are insured with will go to the end of the earth to recover costs from whoever is responsible. They have the muscle and the money. And all jobs are covered for life regardless of whether the builder is alive or dead, in business or insolvent. Once that premium is paid, all jobs done in that coverage period are covered for life. Of course, there would be no case to answer if a 20 yo deck collapsed through lack of maintenance but if a 6 yo deck collapsed the poo would hit the fan.

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## JB1

Seems like QLD have it worked out better than VIC. 
The Victorian Building Commission / Master Building Commission wouldn't lift a finger to help you. 
They are suppose to but in reality, never pursue their members on your behalf. 
Any disputes go to VCAT (small claims court). 
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## ringtail

It does work, when the stars align. In a perfect world where a builder was dodgy, the customer would complain to the QBCC who would send an inspector out. If he found the work wanting, he would order a " direction to rectify" notice and if the builder / tradie did not comply then he/ she would loose their licence. However, the builder/ tradie has a right to object to the ruling which then triggers all kind of long winded rubbish. But the QBCC do act on every complaint from a customer as long as they use a licenced tradie to do the work. OB's are just ignored as tightwads wanting to do dodgy work themselves. OB's are not well liked by anyone up here other than dodgy tradies - who rip into them without recourse. Having been one myself I sympathise with them and give them trade rates, form 16's, advice, hold their hand etc.... But most avoid them unless they want to rip them off.

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## JB1

Fortunately I had no real issues owner building my place. 
The only issue I had with tradies here was with a concreter for my driveway, I think it may end up in court. 
Having said that most tradies I used were referrals. 
I've haven't hear the Vic building commission doing anything useful even when the work was clearly defective. The only real way to force them to fix is taking them to VCAT I.e. suing them. 
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## phild01

Catch 22: 
Good competent tradies - no greedy insurance operators - economy doesn't bleed; 
Bad trades - happy insurance operators - ecomomy bleeds.

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