# Forum Home Renovation Flooring  Polish the floorboards or put in laminate???

## N0mad

Newbie question: 
I have just bought a house (about 1930's) and the floors were described as "queensland pine" by the building inspector. Do you think is is a good idea to try and polish the existing boards or should i just put in laminate on top? How do I determine if the existing boards are good enough to polish (or if they are only good for carrying whatever's on top). 
I am looking at a fair bit of work anyway as the floorboards are currently covered by thin chipboard (nailed down), then vinyl and soft carpet on top  :Doh: . If I decide to go with laminate, should I leave the chipboard and lay the laminate on top of it or should I rip out the chipboard as well and lay the laminate (and underlay) directly on the floorboards?  
R :Confused: ger

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## Vernonv

Welcome to the forum Roger. 
Persoanlly I prefer solid timber floors, over laminate, especially in older houses. You really need to get an idea of what condition the timber is in before you can decide if it's worth polishing.  
Can you get a pic of some uncovered floorboards? It might help in identifying what type of timber it is. I don't know what Qld pine is, maybe hoop or cypress :Confused: .

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## N0mad

I agree, I would also like to have the solid timber exposed if possible. I expect the wood to be Hoop Pine but will get photos as soon as I can (house settles on the 2 of March). Problem might be that it is crappy Hoop Pine that's only good for structural use? I also wouldn't guarantee that the building inspector got it right.

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## N0mad

The floorboards are currently covered by thin chipboard (nailed down), a layer of lino and soft carpet  :Doh: . If I decide to go with laminate, should I leave the chipboard in place and lay the laminate on top of it or should I rip out the chipboard as well and lay the laminate (and underlay) directly on the floorboards?  
Also, how hard is hoop pine? How well does it resist high heels, scratches etc compared to for example baltic pine (I know how soft that is)?

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## Vernonv

> The floorboards are currently covered by thin chipboard (nailed down), a layer of lino and soft carpet . If I decide to go with laminate, should I leave the chipboard in place and lay the laminate on top of it or should I rip out the chipboard as well and lay the laminate (and underlay) directly on the floorboards?

   I think you should put down underlay regardless of whether you rip up the chipboard or not. The chipboard will need to come up if it is not sound (i.e. crumbling, soft, swelled, etc).   

> Also, how hard is hoop pine? How well does it resist high heels, scratches etc compared to for example baltic pine (I know how soft that is)?

   Roger, I would suggest you take off your stilettos before walking on any timber floor  :Biggrin: .

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## N0mad

Vernonv, 
Fortunately my Mrs is the one who uses the heels,  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): . And yes, I know the damage they can do to a wooden floor. I was just curious about how durable hoop pine is compared to baltic pine or various hardwoods. 
And I realise I need an underlay regardless of chipboard or not, I was just a bit unclear in my writing. My conclusion is, that the fate of the chipboard sheets will be sealed by their condition and by the amount of clearance under doors, skirting boards, etc. 
Does that sound correct?

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## Vernonv

I've never had a hoop pine floor, so I don't know how durable it is. 
Your conclusions in regard to the chipboard sound fine.  :2thumbsup:

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## N0mad

I've now had a good look at it and the boards are definitely pine so I will not polish them (too soft in my opinion). The decision is to leave the vinyl in the front hall as it is, remove the vinyl tiles in the kitchen and put in porcelain tiles. In the rest of the house we will rip out the carpet, the foam underlay, the "carpet holding strip things" and the vinyl. The masonite underneath can stay as an underlay to the foam underlay for the laminate floor. Phew! 
Now I just have a few hundred nails and tacks to pull before I can get started. Not to mention the kitchen that I have to rip out. Yeeeeehaaaa!    :Upset:  
I'm sure the rest of the world is doing this right now (I'm the one on the right)  :Pointlaugh:  
R :Shock: )ger

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## chipps

Good luck Nomad. 
Hope the pine's easier than my brushbox http://www.renovateforum.com/showthread.php?t=75323 
My knees, hands & vision are still recovering  :Tongue:

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## binda

I believe hoop pine was a very popular and therefore common flooring material during from 1900 to the WW2 in my area. I presumed it must have been common everywhere until all the trees where cut down. 
If its old pine then it would be such a shame to cover it up unless it was totally trashed. I recently sanded a floor for my inlaws which was 100 year old hoop pine boards (old farm house floor) and how it looked once finished was simply stunning. It went from very dark and dirty from generations of people walking dirt into it, to a wonderful pale yellow and then when the sealer went on, a lovely honey gold appearance.  
And the pine boards had seasoned out completely so the were hard and can could handle heels. thats my 5 cents.

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## N0mad

Progress is being made. Yesterday we pulled out all the carpet from the three bedrooms, the lounge and the dining room. We also pulled all the underlay, all the carpet strips, all the tacks and all the lino underneath! Our luck was that the tacks mostly hadn't penetrated the lino all that much, so were reasonably easy to pull out.  
The floorboards seem to be in a reasonable condition, though you can see where some have been replaced (some are stained, some are not) and there are tin patches covering some holes where the bathroom used to be before it was moved. If I was still considering polishing them I would have to swap about 10 of them, here and there. 
Binda; I don't know if the boards have "seasoned out" or not but they still seem easy enough to scratch using just a fingernail.  
I now have to decide how to level the floor enough for the laminate to lie properly as it isn't exactly flat everywhere (most of it is okay). Anyone care to add their 5 cents?

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## chipps

> Progress is being made. Yesterday we pulled out all the carpet from the three bedrooms, the lounge and the dining room.

  Did you have non-stop sneezing & itching during this process??  :Shock:    

> Our luck was that the tacks mostly hadn't penetrated the lino all that much, so were reasonably *easy to pull out*. ?

  Half your bl*%dy luck !!!  :brava:     

> isn't exactly flat everywhere (most of it is okay). Anyone care to add their 5 cents?

  Great question & am also wondering how to do it  :Confused:   
I have a raised section (2mm approx) in doorway between dinning room & where sunroom was added, been thinking of options....  *1.* Remove timber planks & plane floor joist down a tad  *2*. Remove planks & plane them down on the undersides.  *3*. Perhaps floor sanding machine will do the trick 
Cheers
Cam

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## N0mad

Chipps, I suspect the previous owners cleaned the carpet (even if it didn't look like it  :Biggrin: ) before the house went on sale so sneezing was limited. Pulling the tacks was probably also made easier by the fact that hoop pine is softer than brushbox. I hope your knees, back and eyes are feeling better now  :Rolleyes:  
My thinking is that I will have to rent a small floor sander and grind down a couple of spots as well as fill few places (like around the tin patches, unless I replace those boards). By the way, I found an almost complete newspaper from 1966 spread out under the lino in one of the bedrooms.

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## N0mad

The never ending story continues. Having seen the boards and considering the fact that we would have to sand them a bit anyway to make them smooth enough for the laminate, we have decided to try for a sand and polish job after all. Then if it starts looking crummy after a few years we can always put in laminate on top. This means I will have to find a few recycled floorboards to replace a few damaged ones in 2 of the bedrooms. 
To Chipps delight(?) I have found more little nails that were used to hold down earlier versions of vinyl in the lounge and they are total bastards to get out as the head of the nail often comes off when you try to pull them. In some areas of the lounge there were 4 layers of vinyl! The top one was laid in 1966 (old newspaper underneath). The bottom layer smells strongly of tar and some of it was put in upside down (used as an underlay!?). Unfortunately the print/paint on top of it has partially melted onto the surface of the floorboards, effectively gluing it on. Will see what a hot air gun will do to it. Underneath there is also a couple of rows of little nails that must have held down the earliest layer of vinyl/lino. They sit almost flush with the wood so are really hard to get out. 
In the dining room there was from top to bottom: 1. soft carpet (with nailed edge grippers), 2. foam carpet underlay (stapled), 3. Masonite (nailed), 4. vinyl, 5. more vinyl, 6. floorboards (hopefully nothing more in between). Currently we're down to the masonite. The floor sander and polisher is coming in to inspect tomorrow so we have a lot to do during the coming week  :Biggrin: .

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## kombiman

> The never ending story continues. Having seen the boards and considering the fact that we would have to sand them a bit anyway to make them smooth enough for the laminate, we have decided to try for a sand and polish job after all. Then if it starts looking crummy after a few years we can always put in laminate on top. This means I will have to find a few recycled floorboards to replace a few damaged ones in 2 of the bedrooms. 
> To Chipps delight(?) I have found more little nails that were used to hold down earlier versions of vinyl in the lounge and they are total bastards to get out as the head of the nail often comes off when you try to pull them. In some areas of the lounge there were 4 layers of vinyl! The top one was laid in 1966 (old newspaper underneath). The bottom layer smells strongly of tar and some of it was put in upside down (used as an underlay!?). Unfortunately the print/paint on top of it has partially melted onto the surface of the floorboards, effectively gluing it on. Will see what a hot air gun will do to it. Underneath there is also a couple of rows of little nails that must have held down the earliest layer of vinyl/lino. They sit almost flush with the wood so are really hard to get out. 
> In the dining room there was from top to bottom: 1. soft carpet (with nailed edge grippers), 2. foam carpet underlay (stapled), 3. Masonite (nailed), 4. vinyl, 5. more vinyl, 6. floorboards (hopefully nothing more in between). Currently we're down to the masonite. The floor sander and polisher is coming in to inspect tomorrow so we have a lot to do during the coming week .

  Coarse sand will clean it up. 
Glad you are polishing them, real floorboards rock and hoop pine floors are beautiful! 
Post an after pic please! 
(Brush Box floors here c1960)

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## N0mad

Pulled up all the vinyl and masonite in the central passage yesterday, floor looks okay despite all the little holes from the hundreds of little nails that held down the masonite. We debated a bit about what to do about the dining room and had a good inspection from underneath. Discovered that the boards are pretty ugly compared to the rest of the house. They are clearly recycled, so have lots of extra nail holes, cracks, chips etc. So depending on what the floor sanding bloke says today, we may end up covering that one with laminate after all. 
Kombiman; I will definitely post some pic's after it's done.  
By the way, I wish to present a great big thank you to Bloss who mentioned using vice grips to pull reluctant nails  :Clap2:  . I bought a small set of vice grips/locking pliers and found that once I get a good grip on the nail I can apply my 800mm wrecking bar (my favourite tool) to the conical jaws of the vice grips and get very good leverage. Multiplies pulling power by about 5-6 times! I still haven't found a nail that will refuse me. :Cool:  
Tonight I will pull out the vinyl and masonite from the back hall as well as remove the last things from the kitchen (sink and under sink cupboard). If I'm up to it I may also pull the vinyl tiles and the masonite off the kitchen floor in preparation for tile underlay. During the weekend we'll buy the tiles for the kitchen and back hall (Bu.....s) as well as all the kitchen cupboards, etc (Ikea). If I have any more energy to spend I may start hammering down the floor nails in preparation for sanding.

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## N0mad

Just had a call from the Mrs + talked with the floor sanding guy as well as the house stumping guy. It seems the building inspector missed a few important points!
1. One of the stumps is 30-40mm out of level so the house needs re-leveling before the floors can be sanded etc. 
2. One of the wooden beams underneath the house has sagged a lot (along a wide window) where it was insufficiently supported after some of the stumps were replaced by large steel beams. It needs to be jacked up and a steel post put in underneath.
3. One of the posts holding up the back deck (concrete) is almost rusted through and needs replacing.  
I agree with all the above, having noticed #2 and 3 myself (and indirectly #1). What do we do or say to the building inspector???  :Mad:  
This of course puts floor prep on hold (house leveling is scheduled for Sat 14) as well as laying tiles in the kitchen and back hall, plus putting the kitchen in. Well I suppose we can at least sub-assemble the kitchen downstairs and do some of the other floor preparations in the mean while. This also won't stop the electricians so at least that part can go ahead. 
The floor guy will replace a few bad boards for us (about 15 linear metres) before sanding and reckons it will look quite good when finished. The scheduled moving date on the 26th now seems way too close.  :Cry:

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## N0mad

Not for sale!?
The tiles we had selected at B......s are unavailable despite being shown with a price on them in their display. So now we have to start over with tile selection and colour coordination.  :Mad: 
This renovation stuff is full of small and large pitfalls, not to mention the gaping abyss at the end of the road!

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## N0mad

From now on I am building new stuff instead of ripping out the old, Yipeee! All the floors are now ready for sanding and polishing. All the skirting boards are off, the house is properly levelled, all the  :Upset: nails in the floor have been pulled out or knocked down, etc. We have bought both the wall and floor tiles and most of the materials needed. 
Next I have to level the hallway floor and mount tile underlay on it as well as the kitchen floor. The floor sanding bloke is starting tomorrow and the Tiler will be in next week to do the kitchen and back hall. Then it's time to mount the kitchen and get the plumber and electrician to finish their stuff, paint, re-fit skirting boards and move in! 
End is in sight  :Smilie:

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## N0mad

:Mad:  The floor sanding company were due to start doing our floors yesterday.
They proceeded by not calling us when they were going to be late (finally showed up at 2PM, not early morning as originally agreed on). When they finally arrived they looked around for 15 minutes (again), totally ignored what we were telling them needed to be done first and what had been agreed on during their first visit (level off a beam under the floor in one place as it is poking the floorboards up, bang some creaking ones down, replace the ones we know have borer damage, etc). They mentioned that the replacement boards were going to cost 28$/metre when we had been quoted 35$/metre and that the floor wouldn't be ready for use by Monday morning as originally planned but late on Tuesday, which would have thrown off the schedule for the other trades. Then they promptly left to continue with a different job!  
Sigh! 
We have now told them that we don't require their services any more...  :No: 
This means that I will have to buy some boards and replace them myself, leaving the floor un-sanded and unfinished for now unless we can get someone else to do it on short notice.  :Annoyed:  
Anyone know of a good place for buying replacement hoop pine floor boards in Brisbane?

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## N0mad

Found replacement floorboards (150mm hoop pine) at a recycled building materials shop nearby and we're getting a chippie to put them in for us.

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## N0mad

We are moving in today! The last couple of days we have had quite a few floorboards replaced due to visible borer damage. We then had it roughly sanded so any additional damage would be clearly visible and to make it level enough for laying laminate. This showed that we would have to replace an additional 50-100 lm of floorboards to get rid of all the borer damage, so we have decided to go for laminate instead of polishing it. I would have preferred to be able to polish it, but the estimated cost for getting it all sorted have mounted way beyond the cost for laying laminate.  
You can't sit on the fence forever!
It get's really uncomfortable after a while, not to mention the splinters  :Wink:

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## N0mad

Ordered the laminate on Saturday (Tarkett Bosc Pear). Will arrive before Easter weekend with any luck!? Grand total is about 80 sqm so adds up to a very full and heavy trailerload!

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## N0mad

Picked up the laminate Friday night. It came on a full size pallet weighing in at about 500kg and we had to offload it packet by packet as we don't have a forklift at home  :Smilie: 
There was also a storm threatening to dump some rain on us so we had to be really quick! Oh well, it got inside without getting soaked anyway. Now that I've nearly finished the tiling job in the bathroom, I'll be able to spend some time finishing the kitchen, then I can finally move on to the floors.

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## manofaus

hello
laminate, looks so easy, till you need to go around a doorway.
You are lucky in that you have no skirting or architraves to cut around.
good luck

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## N0mad

Well, I do have a few things I need to go around but they are at least relatively few and as you say, there is no skirting in place at the moment. Should be able to start laying the floor next week, so we will see how I go.

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## Struggo

Hi Nomad, 
New to the forum, great site. 
I was hoping you could kindly pass on feedback re the Tarkett flooring you have laid. It looks the goods in my opinion and I can pick it up for $24/sqm with underlay. 
Cheers
Struggo

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## That Floor Guy

Make sure you leave yourself as much expansion gap as possible with that stuff, especially in the width.

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