# Forum Home Renovation Retaining Walls  Water Feature / Wall Wall - Any ideas???

## Fr_303

I'm in the process of building a water feature -  
Does anyone know of some good sites/forums on water features??? 
Or has anyone got any pics that they would like to share???

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## Eli

What kind of water feature? Pond, fountain, wall?

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## Fr_303

Water Wall.

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## Fr_303

Similar to this but a stacked stone back and no second reseivor

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## mirz

looking nice, may be i should add this to my backyard project too. lol 
will be keeping eye on this thread

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## Bleedin Thumb

Fr 303, 
I admire your enthusiasm, but these things are not easily built. Its not what you see above ground that is necessarily the hard bit, but *sometimes* whats underground that's important. 
I'm talking about the filtration, chemical injection etc. Even the shell will need to be 32 mpa with Xypex added, fully steeled to engineer specs. The cladding is the easy bit. 
BTW I would not be surprised if that water feature that you displayed cost the client $150- $200K. a few years back I did 2 similar ones that cost $280K each. Having said that - these are in the public domain and hence are covered by more stringent safety guidelines. 
The weird thing is that in a public place a water feature where people may come into *CONTACT* with the water requires about $10k + of filtration equipment. 
A swimming pool in a backyard - where people actually *SWIM* in the water requires about $2K of filtration. 
But you can have a rainwater tank where people actually *DRINK* the water and you don't need anything! 
So if your building it at home with a submersible pump in the reservoir the trick is to make the shell watertight 250 -300 thick 32 mpa concrete done in one pour preferably,- if two pours use the correct membrane on the join.

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## mirz

[quote=Bleedin Thumb;639307]BTW I would not be surprised if that water feature that you displayed cost the client $150- $200K. a few years back I did 2 similar ones that cost $280K each. quote]  
280K for water wall only  :Doh:  my whole house is not worth that much  :Shutup2:  
should better stay away from this idea  :Biggrin:

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## Fr_303

> Fr 303, 
> I admire your enthusiasm, but these things are not easily built. Its not what you see above ground that is necessarily the hard bit, but *sometimes* whats underground that's important. 
> I'm talking about the filtration, chemical injection etc. Even the shell will need to be 32 mpa with Xypex added, fully steeled to engineer specs. The cladding is the easy bit. 
> BTW I would not be surprised if that water feature that you displayed cost the client $150- $200K. a few years back I did 2 similar ones that cost $280K each. Having said that - these are in the public domain and hence are covered by more stringent safety guidelines. 
> The weird thing is that in a public place a water feature where people may come into *CONTACT* with the water requires about $10k + of filtration equipment. 
> A swimming pool in a backyard - where people actually *SWIM* in the water requires about $2K of filtration. 
> But you can have a rainwater tank where people actually *DRINK* the water and you don't need anything! 
> So if your building it at home with a submersible pump in the reservoir the trick is to make the shell watertight 250 -300 thick 32 mpa concrete done in one pour preferably,- if two pours use the correct membrane on the join.

   :Shock:  
Jezz I'm building it in my backyard not the grounds of the royal palace. :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):   
Why would I need a filtration system???  
I was planning on using a large Poly or fibreglass trough then bricking around it.  
There has got to be people that have done it *A LOT LOT* cheaper then that??

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## Eli

I think your enthusiasm and a poly tub will get you through fine. You put it in, you rip it out when your wife gets sick of it. No worries. Nothing lasts forever.

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## Fr_303

> I think your enthusiasm and a poly tub will get you through fine. You put it in, you rip it out when your wife gets sick of it. No worries. Nothing lasts forever.

    :2thumbsup:

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## Bleedin Thumb

Yep it looks especially attractive when the water turns to green slime. :Biggrin:   
OK you *can* do it on the cheap...but it wont look like the one in the photo. 
Its like those backyard blitz makeover shows...... a few screws...a bit of silicon...you'll be right mate  .......... as long as it last for the length of the show that is. :Tongue:   
Yep your right Eli....nothing lasts for ever. :No:  :Biggrin:

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## Eli

Obviously he isn't going for the design services, water tight concrete with membrane and two pours and 10k or even 10 bucks worth of filtration.  
As you said, without those, there will be slime. There are still two choices from there. Rip it out because the wife is sick of green slime, or balance the water with plants and fish. It is possible, and not even that hard, to have a body of water without too much engineering and filtration, that doesn't have that much slime in it, especially when you're adding the aeration.  
There has been something suspiciously like this going on for several thousand years in open bodies of water all over the world. For the most part it's worked out pretty well except when humans started messing with it to improve the clarity of the water.  
I'm not saying your view is wrong BT, I'm sure you're more than qualified to offer opinion on the subject. But leave a little bit of room for a fella to muck around in a little pond or something before you crush him. He's game, help him out.   
This will provide plenty of reading for the enthusiastic. And it's a LOT LOT cheaper. And they are most definitely not afraid of green slime  :Biggrin:  http://www.backyardaquaponics.com/forum/portal.php

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## Fr_303

> Yep it looks especially attractive when the water turns to green slime.

    :Doh: Life is not that complicated fellas, some chlorine in the water will keep it clean.   
In a few years  I propbably will rip it down anyway so if the pump last till then all is good. 
You guy's know how to boost a guy's confidence hey.

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## Eli

I thought I was boosting your confidence!

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## mirz

i am sure you can do it without spending thousands of dollars, its just a matter of some research. 
a backyard water wall is totaly different in $ terms from a commercial one accessible by general public.

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## Mickj

A few years ago, I thought it was a good idea building a pond/water feature. I estimated about $400.
When it was finished it ended up costing over $7k. 
I made mine from stone and then fiber-glassed the inside.
But as mentioned, its whats underground that counts.
Unless you want a breeding ground for mozzies, you have to do it right.
I have some Koi fish in mine. They're not there for looks, they're there to help keep the mozzie count down(works well). 
Pumps/filters/UV sterilisers...its all needed.
Build yourself a little rock garden(cheaper running costs)  :Wink:  
Good luck   
Mick

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## dazzler

We rented a place in hobart that had a couple like in the photo.  One had goldfish and waterplants and a bio filter (lots of plastic spiky balls) and seemed to be very well balanced.  had frogses and midgeses and all kinds of creatures, even David Attenborough was seen stalking through the grass :Biggrin:  
The other had no plants or fish and was painted with a black tar stuff. 
It did go green but I just drained it and wiped it with a cloth and refilled it. 
BIL is a marine biologist (I think they were in vogue 15years ago :Wink: ) and does ponds.  He says the trick is plants and balls  :Smilie:

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## Eli

DIY bio-filter http://leisure.prior-it.co.uk/jims-p...biofilter.html

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## Bleedin Thumb

> Similar to this but a stacked stone back and no second reseivor

   As I said, you can do it on the cheap. But you posted this picture as an example of what you wanted to acheive.  Dazzler, youre right about the plants being a good way to keep the water clear. besides providing oxygen they also take up some nutrients.  The biological filtration is done by microbes that cling to anything they can.   The greater the surface area the greater the biomass and hence biological filtering. More plants = more surface area etc.   However this is then a pond which needs relatively still conditions unlike a water-wall. You will then need fish to keep down the mossies so no chlorine - you will also need to keep an eye on nitrite levels and do water changes regularly.  I don't put fish in mine, the mossies do get a bit wild in early summer but once the frog numbers build up it keeps them down. Of course then you need lots of rocks and plants around as habitat.   I built my own water feature on the cheap I dug a hole and lined it with about $10 worth of plastic and maybe $200 worth of plants. 
Good luck building something similar to the one in the photo cheaply.

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## Fr_303

> i am sure you can do it without spending thousands of dollars, its just a matter of some research. 
> a backyard water wall is totaly different in $ terms from a commercial one accessible by general public.

  Too right Mirz  :2thumbsup:

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## mcchaddy

Fr 303, 
This pool and Wall cost me $52,000 about 2 years ago. The excavation cost nearly 17,000 as it was all rock. The wall on the edge is made from old sandstone that came out of an old retaining walll around the property. It is feed from the pool pump and had 2 outlet holes. The actual feature wall took about half a day to put up.

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## dazzler

> Fr 303, 
> This pool and Wall cost me $52,000 about 2 years ago. The excavation cost nearly 17,000 as it was all rock. The wall on the edge is made from old sandstone that came out of an old retaining walll around the property. It is feed from the pool pump and had 2 outlet holes. The actual feature wall took about half a day to put up.

  A few years back I built a house and struck some rock.  The builder, a very religious fellow, arranged for a group from his congregation to come around and pray that there wouldnt be a lot. 
Anyway, the end result was $18000 for it to be dug out, and I said to him "so much for divine intervention" to which he remarked "but how bad could it have been"  :Biggrin:

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## Eli

The Lord saved you thousands!

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## Bleedin Thumb

> A few years back I built a house and struck some rock.  The builder, a very religious fellow, arranged for a group from his congregation to come around and pray that there wouldnt be a lot. 
> Anyway, the end result was $18000 for it to be dug out, and I said to him "so much for divine intervention" to which he remarked "but how bad could it have been"

   It was probably just a small floater until _He_ intervened. 
Didn't you know    ..................................God _hates_ Home Builders! :Biggrin:

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## mirz

checkout these one on eBay:  http://home.search.ebay.com.au/water...0QQsacatZ20716 
they are not looking that bad mate.

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## les88

We have a wall that needs a water feature swmbo said....OK said I .
Thanks to you guys its not going to happen
les

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## woodbe

What effect do the water restrictions have on these things?  
Where we are, just about every public water feature is switched off and dry... 
woodbe.

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## Bleedin Thumb

Why? dont they reticulate the water? :Confused:

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## Fr_303

Has any one actually had success with building one of these?

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## zathras

Strewth, 
I just checked out those stainless walls on E-Bay, and I reckon at the next BBQ, you'd have the blokes lining up in quick order for relief after the first few cans of ale  :Eek:  
Mind you the latest trend in that area is "desert cubes" or similar, no problems then with the water going green because there isn't any! It could go yellow though  :Doh:

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## alpsy

filtration is not necessarily the hard part - a good pump with a biofilter setup (especially if you want koi's) and uvc will take care of it. if you do it right, you'll never even have to clean it except for flushing out the settlement chamber. the harder part is where to hide the filter so that it does not look out of place. 
good luck and with a little planning and determination i believe what your trying to achieve is doable  :Smilie:  
julie

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## pharmaboy2

> Has any one actually had success with building one of these?

  hiya - I did one about 8 years ago in clay ground on a slope (read very reactive site).  about 2m by 1 metre with 2 m wall behind with a mirror on it - the concrete was average 150mm thick with f72 in it.  After pouring, i rendered with a mix with a bit of bondcrete in it, and it never leaked.  You will however need to clean it regularly. 
Now, you dont want fish, but if its under a tree you will need to clean it out every few weeks - i simply siphoned mine to clean.  make sure that wind doesnt naturally blow stuiff into the water (ie needs an edge so blowing leaves hit the edge (mine was flush with the ground - buggar!) 
stacked stone can be stuck to villaboard on a timber frame or brickwork.  The top of a water feature like that is going to be the tough part. Go to nurseries that sell these things and have a look at how they do it - some of them sell ss water walls, which are designed to cascade water over walls - they are $200 through to $600 each depending on width, then add pump and piping. 
Unless you are really interested in designing it and building it for your self, consider buying one.   Go to the ebay page listed above, show the missus, and see what she thinks.  I bought one of crave designs ss water features with a swirl in the ss, have 2 lights shining on it, and no-one has pissed in it yet!  If you want bang for your buck, consider building a villaboard frame stick stacked stones to it about 2m wide, 2m tall, and put a crave designs 600w water feature in front of it, maybe some mondo in a planter surrounding.  couple of hebel renedered benches with cushions, nice paving, and voila you have  a backyard bliss, and your missus owes you a years worth  :Wink:

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## ger

We are currently building a pool and the wife wants one 
of theese  I dont know if it helps http://www.hurlcon.com.au/water/falls.html

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## patty

mate i built a very simple water feature for the outlaws they alreay had an existing blue board wall they painted with exterior swade effect (rough finish) i built a pelmet over the top of it got a 1200mm (4ft) length of 20mm light duty conduit and drilled a series of holes in a straight line with a drill about 3mm plugged and glued a plug in one end fastened underneath the pelmat painted it the same colour as the wall then had a stainless trough made up at work dropped the pump into it ran the piping up the back of the blueboard to hide it and connected it to the other end of the conduit mounted some low voltage downlights under the pelmet to throw light onto the feature very simple cost the inlaws abot $250 bucks did not pay me and they love it and everyone comments on it i will post some pics

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## Fr_303

> mate i built a very simple water feature for the outlaws they alreay had an existing blue board wall they painted with exterior swade effect (rough finish) i built a pelmet over the top of it got a 1200mm (4ft) length of 20mm light duty conduit and drilled a series of holes in a straight line with a drill about 3mm plugged and glued a plug in one end fastened underneath the pelmat painted it the same colour as the wall then had a stainless trough made up at work dropped the pump into it ran the piping up the back of the blueboard to hide it and connected it to the other end of the conduit mounted some low voltage downlights under the pelmet to throw light onto the feature very simple cost the inlaws abot $250 bucks did not pay me and they love it and everyone comments on it i will post some pics

  Thanks would love to see the pics of it

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