# Forum More Stuff At the end of the day  Marc's Musing's

## Marc

Not too long ago the "future" was mud bricks and straw bales. 
Fixation on materials rather than design. 
There was once a panel made from marijuana ... I wonder what happen to that one? Unsustainable perhaps? 
I say that everyone is entitled to chose the building materials he likes, the design he likes, the location he likes. It is not necessary however to disparage the traditional materials, designs or locations in order to make a decision.

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## Bros

> There was once a panel made from marijuana ... I wonder what happen to that one? Unsustainable perhaps? .

  No went up in smoke.

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## toooldforthis

> Both. It is designed then engineered to suit the design. Same should be true with houses.  
> But many people fixate on the components first and have them drive the design and engineering rather than on appropriate design and then material selection to suit the design and engineering

  I knew we would get around to ground level decks built out of timber eventually.

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## UseByDate

> Not too long ago the "future" was mud bricks and straw bales. 
> Fixation on materials rather then design. 
> There was once a panel made from marijuana ... I wonder what happen to that one? Unsustainable perhaps? 
> I say that everyone is entitled to chose the building materials he likes, the design he likes, the location he likes. It is not necessary however to disparage the traditional materials, designs or locations in order to make a decision.

  Hempcrete

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## UseByDate

> Both. It is designed then engineered to suit the design. Same should be true with houses.  
> But many people fixate on the components first and have them drive the design and engineering rather than on appropriate design and then material selection to suit the design and engineering

  You still seem to be separating the process of design from that of engineering. For 35 years of my 44 year salaried working life I was a professional design engineer. I always considered design as a part of the engineering process and not a process that precedes engineering. Ie engineering starts when design starts. Often new materials do drive new designs.

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## UseByDate

> I knew we would get around to ground level decks built out of timber eventually.

   :No:

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## SilentButDeadly

> You still seem to be separating the process of design from that of engineering. For 35 years of my 44 year salaried working life I was a professional design engineer. I always considered design as a part of the engineering process and not a process that precedes engineering. Ie engineering starts when design starts. Often new materials do drive new designs.

  True...but rarely in this forum and even more rarely in real life (or it could be the other way around) does this actually happen.  
Mostly we are bowerbirds with the building nouse of pidgeons...

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## Marc

Well there you go, still smouldering.  :Smilie:  
It has been the fixation of architects and other garden variety socialist, to build with industrial products and mask their "social reform" agenda with statements of them being the "future", and how the "other" materials are all dinosaurs of the past adding an array of other negative attributes too boring to list.  
 When my older brother was studying architecture, I remember his rants against "the brick", as the symbol of the past, enslaving workers to work like ants to erect a wall and making building "unsustainable' ... Thats right, this has been around a long time. My brother retired from his position of head of the chair of semiotics at the university of architecture and has yet to make a dent in the status of "the brick".  
The reality is that building materials, are adopted or get relegated to the pile of "pie in the sky" by the market. And the market is savage and dispassionate. The market does not care for social statements ... well not here anyway. May be North Korea? Public buildings are an exception because government pays 4 times what the private sector pays for everything and materials are no exception, so you can sell fancy panels to build in Antarctica or Mars or a shade structure for a school at 10 times it's value, no problem.  
Sure, "one day" you will be able to order a house on line and get it posted in instalments and direct debited to your salary. 
I am always reminded of my primary school teacher who told me that in the year 2000 all cars will fly as a matter of fact. Still waiting for a car with technology different from my first car ... a 1929 Buick like this one (only mine was burgundy and had wood spokes not wire) ... what is the difference with my current car? Not much at all.

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## UseByDate

> I am always reminded of my primary school teacher who told me that in the year 2000 all cars will fly as a matter of fact. Still waiting for a car with technology different from my first car ... a 1929 Buick like this one (only mine was burgundy and had wood spokes not wire) ... what is the difference with my current car? Not much at all.

  You had a primary school teacher that could see into the future?   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRZNLBL7Px4

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## UseByDate

> Engineering starts when design starts.

  Actually, to be more precise, engineering starts with a description of a problem that needs to be solved. In my field of engineering this document would be called a requirements document and is produced by the customer. A supplier would then tender a proposal (sometimes just a feasibility study) that addresses the described problem. If the proposal is a novel solution, then crude design must be undertaken to scope out the work prior to tendering the proposal. If the tender is accepted then detail design starts.

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## UseByDate

> Still waiting for a car with technology different from my first car ... a 1929 Buick like this one (only mine was burgundy and had wood spokes not wire) ... what is the difference with my current car? Not much at all.

  We can't answer without knowing what you current car is but I suspect your current car has better brakes, better lights, better gearbox, more efficient engine and much better crash protection.

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## Marc

> You had a primary school teacher that could “see” into the future?   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRZNLBL7Px4

  Actually it's almost the opposite ... she _assumed_ she could see the future. Just like you assume that that contraption is an actual flying car. It is not it's a ridiculous gimmick that does not even fly, it actually hangs in a pathetic way from a piece of canvas. That is not a mode of transportation as a flying car is supposed to be, you know, that thing with 4 wheels you park in your garage and then you go out on the road and pull a leaver and fly to work? In order for that to be a reality we need to completely redesign our cities, starting with burying all wires and then when we finish designing and rebuilding the city, incarcerate 50% of the current car drivers.

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## Marc

> We can't answer without knowing what you current car is but I suspect your current car has better brakes, better lights, better gearbox, more efficient engine and much better crash protection.

  What is different? 
Compare with my wife's Holden Calais, not my Toyota Surf. It's a 6 Cylinder petrol engine with overhead valves. Tick same thing. 
Water cooled with a circulating pump turned by the belt. Tick, as opposed to the Ford model A, water was circulated by a centrifugal pump. Grease nipples all over the place some you don't really know where they are? Actually the Buick had one over the Holden, Centralised nipples on the side of the car, open a little window and there they are all in a row. Gearbox? If you call the first gear synchronized instead of a crunch first gear an innovation, you have something else coming. 
Something different would be an engine that runs on a chemical reaction from a pill you pop in the tank and lasts all day. A nuclear fission engine, an acetylene engine, an anti gravitational machine. Not a lousy internal combustion engine that packs technology a century old. Oh yea it has FM and digital radio ... wow!  Did I mention airbags that kill you?

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## chrisp

> Still waiting for a car with technology different from my first car ... a 1929 Buick like this one (only mine was burgundy and had wood spokes not wire) ... what is the difference with my current car? Not much at all.

  I can see you in a car like that all those years ago - and somehow I can still see it as a car that would suit you down to the ground today. 
You're right - not much has changed. The chemical reactions to produce the energy are much the same. I suppose the laws of thermodynamics still apply now as back then. 
But what has changed? The efficiency, the performance, the safety (ABS, ESC), reduced pollution, greater comfort, greater reliability.... 
Cars like that are magnificent museum pieces or collectors' cars, but for everyday transport they are well past their use by date.

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## Marc

I wish I still had it. Sure it was slower and did not hold the road as well, but it was and still is a grand ride. I saw one parked on the road not long ago and the inside smelled just like mine from the wood and the horsehair padding and who knows what else.  :Smilie: 
I liked the sound of the engine the most. 
This is more like the one I had, although it sounds a bit anemic. Mine was made in Canada and was right hand drive from factory.

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## OBBob

> ... I saw one parked on the road not long ago and the inside smelled just like mine...

  Was it broken down with a smell of burnt oil and steam?   :Biggrin:

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## UseByDate

> Actually it's almost the opposite ... she _assumed_ she could see the future. Just like you assume that that contraption is an actual flying car. It is not it's a ridiculous gimmick that does not even fly, it actually hangs in a pathetic way from a piece of canvas. That is not a mode of transportation as a flying car is supposed to be, you know, that thing with 4 wheels you park in your garage and then you go out on the road and pull a leaver and fly to work? In order for that to be a reality we need to completely redesign our cities, starting with burying all wires and then when we finish designing and rebuilding the city, incarcerate 50% of the current car drivers.

  All aircraft capable of controlled flight “hang” from something.
 Conventional aeroplane = wings
 Helicopter = main rotor hub
 Vertical take off aeroplane = engine bearings
 Why would you want to “pull” a leaver in order to fly? To each his own I suppose. You could pull a lever but I would prefer just to push a button. :Tongue:

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