# Forum Home Renovation Electrical  Hardwired Ovens ????

## wanted

Hi All 
Just wondering if someone can clarify what the Aust Stds say in regards to hardwiring electrical ovens? 
I'm currently in a bit of a pickle between the builder & service technician. I have an electric oven which has been hard wired by my builder, unfortunately it has developed a fault and a service technician was called to address the issue under the manufactures warranty. 
The service technician refuses to work on the unit because he beleives it is not installed electrically correct and does not want to risk loosing his license. The builders electrician has cut the end of the flex plug and hard wired the unit in a distribution box. It's is on a seperate circuit with its own breaker. 
The technician claims because the electrician cut the plug lead the unit no longer complies with the aust standard as compliance was only given with the plug intact. 
Who is correct???? I just want my bloody oven fixed - been without for 1 week so far. 
Thanks 
Anthony

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## rrobor

I believe the service tech is correct, your oven should be plugged into a dedecated wall socket. That it is on a separate circuit with a switch almost saves the sparky but not quite. He chopped off a plug. That is an alteration of the specs of the cooker, he should have known better. The repair guy is a bit pedantic, he could have warned you and had you sign that he had and fixed the thing and advised you to get the sparky back to correct. My advice is phone the cooker company up, ask to speak to the manager, Explain that you will be getting the sparky back to fix and ask he sends his guy back on that understanding. Better still get your wife to do it.

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## dib

I don't know but I'd be really annoyed at the technician. Unless you get a definitive answer here and the builder wont help you out, I would be talking to the department of fair trading or whatever they are called in WA.

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## wanted

I beleive the tech is correct as well - the builder is currently taking the matter up with the manufacture. 
I dont beleive that tech will touch the installation until it is correct. 
But surely this way of installation will still comply with the stds. I guess at the end of the day if the manufacture specifies the unit to be installed in a certain way it must be followed. 
Anthony

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## rrobor

Yep its the usual everybody getting uptight. So no dont start screaming. As a tech in another field I can tell you that doesnt work,  everybody just digs in. Its all bordering on being a bit silly and you are the poor begger who suffers.

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## Peeeeda

Agree totally with the service tech.  Take the case of a 900mm slide in stove with gas cooktop/electric oven.  These often come with a short flex and a 15amp plug.  The lazy sparky simply cuts off the plug and wires it into a junction box.  As a gas installer this makes my job extra hard as I can now only pull the stove out a short distance to fit the gas at the back.  How hard/ expensive is it to fit a 15amp socket?  Not very I suspect.  Some sparkies do the job right.  Some couldn't give a stuff and just cut and run.  Makes me wanna smash my head in... just like Gooner... rant

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## mattwilliams78

This really surprises me. My electrician did the same and hard wired the oven in on its own breaker. I had noticed that the cooktop had no plug while the oven did and I thought perhaps the cooktop would have some kind of plug added but when I checked AS3000 and saw the cooktop had to be hard wired I just assumed the oven woud be hard wired too (as the old combined oven/cooktop one was). This makes sense to me. 
I read, and was warned by the electrician, that I should have an isolation switch for the cooktop - but I don't - and neither to any of my friends, family or anyone else I randomly polled. 
This just seems a bit "jobsworth" to me. Why is it ok for a cooktop to be hardwired and not an oven?

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## mattwilliams78

Ok peeeda, I can see where you're coming from. But why does this matter for an electric oven? and why would a gas oven need a 15amp supply? 
I think a better idea would be a removable connector on the back of the oven.

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## Bedford

> Hi All 
> The service technician refuses to work on the unit because he beleives it is not installed electrically correct and does not want to risk loosing his license. The builders electrician has cut the end of the flex plug and hard wired the unit in a distribution box. It's is on a seperate circuit with its own breaker.

  Not exactly sure of the regulations but my understanding is that the oven has to be able to be isolated from supply, within sight of the appliance. 
This could be hard wired with an isolater (within sight) or by being unplugable. 
The fact that it is on it's own circuit with a breaker would be normal, but the problem can arise if someone turns on the breaker that is out of sight of the serviceman while he's working on it. 
My 2 cents  :Smilie:

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## rrobor

I think you will find that all the answers logically are simple. A gas cooktop with an electric oven if faulty say with leakage to be safe needs to be quickly isolated from power. As the oven uses less than 15A, plug and socket is the simple method. When it comes to say an all electric cooker or cooktop it can use much more than 15A and there is no explosion danger so it can be hard wired with a heavy cable to the fusebox .

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## Smurf

I can confirm that, in Tasmania at least, electrical inspectors sure won't be happy if the plug is cut off and the appliance hard wired. Only real exceptions are air-conditioners and water heaters which under most circumstances _must_ be hard wired in a domestic situation in Tas but it's different in other states.  
Personally I don't totally agree with their logic especially if it's all-electric (no gas) cooker as I think they're being somewhat pedantic, but that's the law and down here at least there is some attempt to enforce it. 
That said, my own oven (dual fuel) with it's 10 amp plug is simply plugged in along with the dishwasher in a cupboard. Not really all that accessible, but nobody's going to fine me for plugging something in to a 10 amp GPO (though I suppose they could question why I installed a double GPO for a dishwasher...).

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## elkangorito

The connection is legal according to ASNZS3000:2007 A1:
3.7.2.8 Flexible cords.
Joints in flexible cords may be made—
(b) by means of suitable cable couplers.
Connections between a flexible cord and installation wiring shall be made in
a purpose-made device containing suitable screwed or crimped terminals. A "purpose-made device" can be an isolating switch or a junction box. 
According to the current standard, an isolation switch must be installed near the appliance ONLY if it is a fixed or stationary cooking appliance having an open cooking surface incorporating electric heating elements, e.g. cooktop, deep fat fryer, barbecue griddle or similar. 
Definitions references;
1.4.10 Appliance, stationary.
a fixed appliance or it weighs more than 18kg and not provided with a carrying handle. 
1.4.7 Appliance, fixed.
An appliance that's fastened to a support or otherwise secured in a specific location.

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## mattski2008

Electrically there is nothing wrong with cutting of the plug and hardwiring it. It is not breaking any rules or laws. We install hundreds of ovens/cooktops in units and houses in QLD and do them all this way if they come supplied with a lead. We r also the service agent for all leading brands and repair them if they are installed like this. We have never had a supplier come back to us with this question. If anyone else has please let me know. The problem with putting in a powerpoint for the oven is that under the new rule book you have to have all socket outlets up to 20A on an RCD regardless of what it is or whether it's accessible. This would cause endless problem with tripping.  Only in NZ is there any requirement for connection of a cooking appliance and that only applies to a freestanding stove, which must be connected via a powerpoint on an RCD.As for the switch question an oven doesn't have to have a switch/isolator other than the circuit breaker in the board. the requirement is only for a fixed or stationary cooking appliance having an open cooking surface with electric heating elements.(eg. electric cooktop, deep fryer)
I am probably wrong but i have checked the new AS3000 and cant find anywhere that says a cooktop must be hardwired. (mattwilliams78 please correct me)
Hope this helps

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## Bedford

> According to the current standard, an isolation switch must be installed near the appliance ONLY if it is a fixed or stationary cooking appliance having an open cooking surface incorporating electric heating elements, e.g. cooktop, deep fat fryer, barbecue griddle or similar.

  Wanted, is this oven screwed to the wall/cupboard ? in which case it's fixed. 
Does this oven have a griller that requires the door to be open when in use ? In which case it needs to be unpluggable or have an isolation switch, as I understand the above. :Smilie:

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## rrobor

That rule applies to an electrical appliance not a dual fuel unit.

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## mattwilliams78

sorry Mattski - I'll have to look at AS3000 tomorrow at work, but other people have talked about the same clause here - the need to isolate a cooktop (which I interpreted as a hardwired relay switch as it draws about 30-35 Amps I think). Everyone in the UK has an isolation switch for cookers (a big red switch next to the cooker on a standard GPO) but I hadn't seen them here so much so I was surprised when my electrician (and AS3000) told me I needed one but, being a nice bloke, he left it up to me to choose and,having not really seen them anywhere before I told him not to worry.  
I had assumed the isolation point was there for if you had a chip pan fire or something and you had to switch off the power in a hurry and i thought that was probably the least of your issues as it wouldn't really stop the fire instantly in an electric fire. I hadn't really thought of the "somebody closing the breaker while you're working on the oven" issue but, to be honest, that risk is just as bad as if you were working on any other GPO or lighting circuit so I can't see the point of enforcing it on this one piece of kit.

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## wanted

> Wanted, is this oven screwed to the wall/cupboard ? in which case it's fixed. 
> Does this oven have a griller that requires the door to be open when in use ? In which case it needs to be unpluggable or have an isolation switch, as I understand the above.

  Bedford 
The oven is installed in a cabinet recess and screwed in place. I've checked the manual regarding the grill function and no mention that the door must be left open...... i guess this means no need for an isolation switch close by. 
However the manual does state " The oven fitted with 3 x 1.5mm cord set in which case connect the 15A plug to a compatible power outlet socket located in an adjacent cupboard and wall unit" 
So basically the installation does comply with the AS3000 but becuase the elcectrician cut the plug of the lead does not comply with the manufactures installation instructions.  
What a load of SH** 
Anthony

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## rrobor

I think this is a question slightly outside the sparkies rule book. I believe the plug is required due to the hob being gas not because of any grill issue. Its there as a fast method of isolating the cooker in the event of a gas leak. The plug would be fitted as that is code for that type of appliance.

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## GraemeCook

I just pulled our stove out and had a look - yep, it is hard wired. 
We are involved with rental housing so I rang our maintenance coordinator and asked: 
"How many stoves & cooktops are hard-wired?"  *Answer*  "All of them." 
"How many stoves & cooktops are wired on a separate circuit?"  *Answer*  "All of them." 
"How many stoves & cooktops have isolation switches?"  *Answer*  "Three or four."    

> I can confirm that, in Tasmania at least, electrical inspectors sure won't be happy if the plug is cut off and the appliance hard wired. Only real exceptions are air-conditioners and water heaters which under most circumstances _must_ be hard wired in a domestic situation in Tas but it's different in other states.

  
Are you sure of this, Smurf?   My laymans understanding was that all appliances rated at 2,400 watts or higher had to be hardwired in Tasmania.  
This debate has raised important questions as to what precisely are the standards, have they been changed and what are the grandfathering provisions? 
Cheers 
Graeme

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## Smurf

> Are you sure of this, Smurf? My laymans understanding was that all appliances rated at 2,400 watts or higher had to be hardwired in Tasmania.  
> This debate has raised important questions as to what precisely are the standards, have they been changed and what are the grandfathering provisions? 
> Cheers 
> Graeme

  A few points of clarification. 
Where I mentioned not being allowed to cut the plug off, what I meant is that you can't run the hard wiring directly to the appliance in place of the flexible cord. The reason for that relates to the cord forming part of the appliance as it was approved and related matters such as maximum operating temperature of the wiring where it enters the appliance. For example, the manufacturer may have used a high temp rated cord and there could be a fire risk if this was replaced by lower temperature rated fixed wiring where it enters the appliance.  *Following is only relevant in Tasmania and does not apply in the other states*. 
As for heaters, air-conditioners and hot water services, there's nothing to stop you plugging them in except that you are not allowed to install a GPO of any type connected to Tariffs 41/42 (24 hour heating / hot water) ,61 or 62 (the two different off-peak tariffs). T41/42 are for residential use only although there is a separate hot water only (not space heating) tariff now available to business users. 
So in Tasmania if you wanted to plug in your air conditioner or hot water service then you can do so. And yes you can have a 15 or 20 amp GPO installed for this. BUT the GPO must be connected to Tariff 31 (Light & Power) which costs 19.646 cents per kWh. 
Hard wire these appliances and you could use Tariff 41/42 for 11.847 cents / kWh which is a very substantial saving - hence in a domestic situation a plugged in air-conditioner or HWS would generally be considered defective work from the perspective of both the customer and Aurora (the power supplier) even though it's not actually illegal in terms of AS3000. You're paying 40% less for the power if it's hard wired (50 to 55% less in the case of off-peak) so it wouldn't make sense to plug it in unless it was a temporary situation.   
Quite a lot of older houses were wired with T61 / 62 (off-peak) GPO's and these can still be used legally but haven't been allowed in new installations since the early 1980's.  
So it's not illegal to plug them in. But it will end up being cheaper to have them hard wired to take advantage of the 40% discount on power used.

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## rrobor

I think you guys are missing the point, How many of those stoves, and I believe this will only relate to a stove with a  gas hob and an electric oven.

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## wanted

Hi All - I think the problem is sorted out now.  
I got a phone call from the manufacture after they spoke to the builder and will be sending out an electrician tomorrow to fix the oven which is wired correctly to aust stds. 
Apparently the service technician that come out before - his license did not allow him to disconnect / reconnect any fixed wiring, so instead of telling me this and arranging for someone else to come out he decided to spin some crap that it does not comply. 
Hopefully i'll get my oven up and running tomorrow. 
Thanks for all your replies.
Anthony

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## Peeeeda

The poor service tech shouldn't need to have a restricted electrcial licence.  To repair or replace a gas cooktop I need to remove the electric oven.  If the plug's been cut off and it's hard wired then I either sprain my kidney trying to contort past it or I unwire it and get it completely out of the way.  If I wire it back wrong and blow up the electric oven then I'm the cowboy.. not the dill who cut the plug off.  
Note to self: Next time I run new pipe from the gas meter.. run it accross the front of the electrical box so the door only partly opens  :Smilie:   Yeeehhaaaa!

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## elkangorito

> Electrically there is nothing wrong with cutting of the plug and hardwiring it. It is not breaking any rules or laws. We install hundreds of ovens/cooktops in units and houses in QLD and do them all this way if they come supplied with a lead. We r also the service agent for all leading brands and repair them if they are installed like this. We have never had a supplier come back to us with this question. If anyone else has please let me know. *The problem with putting in a powerpoint for the oven is that under the new rule book you have to have all socket outlets up to 20A on an RCD regardless of what it is or whether it's accessible.* This would cause endless problem with tripping.  Only in NZ is there any requirement for connection of a cooking appliance and that only applies to a freestanding stove, which must be connected via a powerpoint on an RCD.As for the switch question an oven doesn't have to have a switch/isolator other than the circuit breaker in the board. the requirement is only for a fixed or stationary cooking appliance having an open cooking surface with electric heating elements.(eg. electric cooktop, deep fryer)
> I am probably wrong but i have checked the new AS3000 and cant find anywhere that says a cooktop must be hardwired. (mattwilliams78 please correct me)
> Hope this helps

  
There is an exception to this rule for cooking appliances in ASNZS3000:2007 Amendment 1.
See 2.6.3.1, Exception B.

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## Smurf

My dual fuel cooker (electric oven and grill, gas cooktop) is supplied via a 10A GPO on an RCD. Thus far it hasn't caused tripping and I've had it nearly 2 years. :Smilie:

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## Vernonv

Our oven and stove (seperate circuits) are on RCD protected circuits and they have never ever tripped (in 7 or so years).

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## GraemeCook

> A few points of clarification.

  
Thanks Smurf. 
Cheers   
Graeme

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## damien

When I replaced my oven, the old one was just on 30 years old (hardwired 2 phase), with a new blanco, my electrician just put in a new 15amp socket using one of the cables from the old oven (he inspected the cabling first though). 
Nice simple install for him and me.

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## Pete F

> When I replaced my oven, the old one was just on 30 years old (hardwired 2 phase), with a new blanco, my electrician just put in a new 15amp socket using one of the cables from the old oven (he inspected the cabling first though). 
> Nice simple install for him and me.

  This is an interesting situation, and one I currently face; hard wired full electric replaced with dual fuel range and a 15A GPO installed. First clue all was not right was that the unit couldn't be pushed back hard against the wall due to the power plug. Then it caused the power lead to be bent at an abrupt angle. Replacing with a side entry plug is fine, however I understand the GPO cannot actually go in the same cavity as the oven. I'm buggered if I can find any reference to this however ie a REQUIREMENT for the GPO to be in an adjacent cupboard. Since this is a gas cooker/electric oven there is no requirement to be able to isolate the oven, but I'm wondering just how kosher it is having the GPO behind the oven?

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## barney118

I never thought to ask the same question, my 900mm gas cooktop/electric combo came with an extremely short set of wires (you could have mistaken it to be cut off, thats the way I thought it came), the sparky used a jbox to join it into the new wiring that went into the MRCD 20 A and the isolation switch in the middle of a GPO installed at the same time.

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## mirz

how much it cost around to get a new connection for 30amp oven, cable run, and new circuit breaker (15~20m) from elec box? 
i need to get one done at my place soon. its a dedicated elect oven  Bosch Household Appliances - Appliances - Cooking - Ovens - Single - HBA13B250A 
Technical information:
63 litres cavity volume
270°C max. temperature
1 pc circular oven lighting on top at 40W *2.9 kW total connected load*
220–240V/50–60Hz

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