# Forum Home Renovation Asbestos  Asbestos exposure... Worried about my family.

## Abunai

Hi,  I know this topic is regurlaly discussed but I need to explain my situation and need help. Thank you.  My father was doing some interior renovation in my flat for me.  There was a huge misunderstanding and while I was away, he drilled two 6mm holes in a fibro wall (likely 15 % asbestos in it). No protection, nothing, the dust was even collected with a brush and put in the regular bin in another room... Total disaster.  Several concerns : - my dad took the main exposure while drilling - my mother collected the dust - I came back home at this moment and didn't realize the danger right away as there was no obvious dust remaining. I stayed for at least 4 hours in this room after the incident, working on my computer... Windows were closed, it's a small room in a medium flat. - Pretty much ALL of my clothes were lying on the ground (not covered) during the drilling and for hours after. I came back from holidays just before and didn't have time to put them in the closet. - Pretty much everything I own and use daily was in that room also : hundreds of books, dvds, computers, some important papers, the backpack I use all the time, my very expensive desk chair, etc. Nothing was protected. - Closets were wide open with many more clothes inside  
When I realized that the place needed proper cleaning, I started to panick. I just put the clothes on the balcony and left the room, collecting the remaining dust under the drilling site with a wet towel. I opened the windows.  It's been 3 days and I didn't have time to go back in the room yet for proper cleaning. I'm scared on top of that. The door stayed closed, windows opened. I had to go in there to get some stuff though.  I bought a proper mask and gloves and plan to get back in there today and to clean it all with wet wipes. I also plan to wash my clothes. Someone will lend me a professional HEPA vacuum on tuesday to finish the job.  I made a lot of phone calls since then to know what to do. Nobody seemed concerned really, saying it's nothing.  They just told me : - clean the room and stuff - fill the holes - wash your clothes (at home) I plan to do some lab testing on random parts of the room (ground, walls, desk, books) and on clothes. My question : - do I have to put EVERYTHING I OWN in the bin ? Are my clothes or desk chair or desk computer screwed even with cleaning and washing ? - Will my flat be safe again ? I stayed in since the accident, probably spreading fibres everywhere... - I know a single exposure is not that bad and my father doesn't care. The contamination of clothes, books and of the whole flat might mean long term exposure though. For me and people around me !  So I have a plan but I don't know if it's good. I have a chronic disease so I know how to emotionally handle hardcore stuff but this one is weird and terrifying. Nightmare actually.  I know it's everything we shouldn't do but it's an accident. I knew the wall may have asbestos but never imagined my father would drill in it. Someone told me that yes, this is fibro. I have not been able to sleep since. It has nothing to do with a short exposure outside   What would you do ?  Thanks a lot

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## cyclic

Two 6mm holes in a 1% asbestos sheet..
Just get on with your life.

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## Abunai

Thank you. 
More like 15 % but, still not pure of course. 
But you know, I read some of the horror stories : "just one fiber to kill you", "thousands of fibers are released in the air after each drilling", "fiber stay in the air for years", "they will never leave your clothes", etc.

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## Abunai

I don't see my message anymore. 
So the initial topic was : 
(Short version) 
- my father drilled the wrong wall during some renovation in my flat : he drilled two holes in a fibro wall (15 % asbestos) with a powertool and no protection whatsoever
- the dust was collected with a boom and put in the regular bin in another room..
- basically all of my clothes were lying on the ground, almost under the drilling
- hundreds of books, dvds and a desk, two computers, printers and stuff were also exposed in the room
- I didn't realize the danger right away and stayed in the (small) room for hours after that, windows closed 
I almost finished the cleaning, washed my clothes and filled the holes.  
Is it a huge concern ? Should I bin everything I had in this room instead of cleaning ?

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## Marc

I cut asbestos with a wood handsaw to make rabbit boxes as a teenager before they made it known what they knew from the start ... that it was dangerous. Well I am still around and kicking 50 years later. Most people that are involved in DIY renovations do way more than you have done with no harm. Not saying to be complacent, but it is not the plague and that can be classified as nothing to worry about. Just don't do it again.  
And make sure you vote Le Pen  :Smilie:

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## Abunai

Thank you. 
I know it doesn't seem much but when you read all those horror stories... : "one drilling can release millions of fibers", "fibers will stay in the air for a very long time and they will never leave your clothes", etc... 
That's the remaining fibers in my flat and on my clothes I'm really worried about.

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## cyclic

I started in the building industry in 1965.
I have asbestos plaques in my lungs but I believe the pills I take for osteoarthritis will kill me long before the asbestos, or some idiot will knock me off my bicycle. 
Clean up as best you can, wash the cloathes, and enjoy life.

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## Marc

> Thank you. 
> I know it doesn't seem much but when you read all those horror stories... : "one drilling can release millions of fibers", "fibers will stay in the air for a very long time and they will never leave your clothes", etc... 
> That's the remaining fibers in my flat and on my clothes I'm really worried about.

  Actually fibres are heavy and fall down quickly.

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## Abunai

The cement dust falls down quickly... But I read that the asbestos fibres themselves are so small and light they can stay up for days, months... And they go up again very easily.

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## havabeer

you, your father and your family will be fine 
2x 6mm holes is nothing. the people they worry about are the ones who use a 5" grinder on the stuff with no dust mask. if you're honestly that worried about it, put on a dust mask and sperm suit and wash the entire area down.

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## johnc

It is extremely unlikely you will have inhaled any asbestos fibre, even if you have it is extremely unlikely to lodge in your lungs, even if it does there is close to a zero chance of it becoming a risk to your health, Most people who come into regular contact with asbestos will lead normal lives unaffected by their exposure. However we should be careful, follow instructions when handling, like others I have had early asbestos exposure, I don't expect it will cause me any problems and have never lost any sleep over it. Of all the ways you might die I think you can remove asbestos from the list, you are most likely in greater danger from the items you eat and drink and that includes choking hazard. Did you know you are actually in greater danger of dying falling out of bed than from asbestos risk from a couple of random holes.

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## Spottiswoode

+1 Relax a little. It's not that bad. You have done the right thing by cleaning up with wet wiping and leaving the room to air for a few days. 
You also mention it is 'likely 15% asbestos' so might not be either. 
Either way, go in and clean everything up for peace of mind. Wear a dust mask, use wet wipes on all dust and dispose of them, wash your clothes and vacuum the floor with the HEPA machine if it is carpet. Cover the holes with something like paint or PVA glue so they wont spread any more fibres then try to forget about it. Have a shower afterwards, then some fine wine and relax. 
There are asbestos fibres in the air naturally, a few more from a couple of holes is unlikely to cause issue.

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## Spottiswoode

oops double post. 
but also consider that if asbestos was as dangerous as a lot of people think it is, then we wouldn't have any builders, brake mechanics or people who worked/lived near a train line alive that are older than about 40.

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## PlatypusGardens

Oh.....I thought this was a thread from our regular worrying mate from Wollongong.
He's been quiet lately.....hope he's ok.   
not heard from him since the raw oyster episode...   :Unsure:

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## Marc

I think Abunai you are far more at risk of falling prey of yet another marxist government then asbestosis  :Smilie:

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## Abunai

Thank you all.  
I know it sounds ridiculous but I still can't get over it as so many books and clothes were exposed and are difficult to wash completely. 
I read too much about it too. The maximum safe level for everyday environment is 5 fibers / L and they say drilling a hole produces 460 fibers / L ! 
I'm 98 % sure it is a good old fibro wall from the 60's... But I didn't know that asbestos was just there, I thought it would be inside the wall and not accessible like that. 
I had two papers from "experts" when I bought the flat : one from 2005 saying nothing about this wall, the other from last year saying "possible asbestos, need a lab analysis to confirm". So I just basically forget about the possible danger and didn't see the need to double check. 
I wish they would write something like this (in red) : "This wall might contain asbestos. Consider it does : do not drill or cut, avoid all disturbing !" 
But no, it was just in blue letters : "possible asbestos".

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## joynz

I'm sure it will be fine.  Just a couple of points for the future:  
Don't use a vacuum until you have damp wiped everything.  Household HEPA vacuums are NOT effective against asbestos.   
Regarding the clothes: dip your clothes in a tub of water a few times, then repeat with fresh water, then hang outside on the line to dry. 
Great user name by the way, given the subject.  Do you really live in France?

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## Abunai

Yes I wiped everything before vacuuming. It was a professional Hepa vacuum (Numatic). 
Ok, will do that for the remaining clothes and curtains. 
Yes, France.

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## Smurf

If you live in an urban area then you will have had some level of exposure. That is 100% certain due to there being a background level simply due to how much of the stuff is around, old car brakes (and asbestos was only phased out for those a few years ago so still some around today) and so on. 
Like most medical things the risk increases with the level of exposure. One fibre = very unlikely it will hurt you. Work with the stuff every day = very real risk. 
It's a bit like drinking or smoking. One drink won't kill your liver and you'd be incredibly unlucky if one cigarette stuffed your lungs. But drink 10 beers a day, every day, and then there's a lot more risk. Same with someone who smokes daily for many years, the chance of something bad happening increases with the level of exposure. 
What I'd do is very thoroughly ventilate the place. ALL doors and windows wide open and let the breeze blow through. Obviously that's just moving any residual dust from inside to outside but at least it will be far more dilute out there. 
Throw out anything obviously contaminated. Clean the rest just in case. 
Live your life as normal but make sure to avoid any unnecessary asbestos exposure due to the dose / risk relationship. But if you've only done it once then you'd be unlucky to end up with health problems because of that, just don't do it again.  
No point getting stressed about it now. What's done can't be undone in terms of exposure and it's not like you've been working in a mine, factory making things out of asbestos etc where workers had very high levels of exposure every day and ended up dead because of it. You've had a relatively small exposure, once, so the risk whilst not absolutely zero is certainly low. Keep it in perspective. 
I repeat the point about stress. Get yourself too stressed about it and you'll end up with a heart attack. Seriously. Stressing about the one-off exposure to asbestos is more likely to kill you (due to heart attack) than the asbestos itself. So get on with life but keep well clear of the stuff in future. 
If you ever need a sample tested then in Australia there are various labs who will do it and they're not overly expensive. They do insist that the sample is brought in to them properly sealed (eg inside a plastic bag, which is sealed and then placed inside another plastic bag which is also sealed - commonly known as "double bagging"). I don't know the cost in France but in Australia it wouldn't be much more than $100 (about 70 Euros) for a sample to be tested in a privately owned laboratory offering services to the public. I don't know about the situation in France and whether such laboratories would be privately owned or run by government but presumably they would exist in the major cities.

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## ringtail

If you have ever walked outside you have inhaled asbestos. End of story. Automotive brakes were asbestos for decades and maybe still are in europe. All that brake dust goes to atmosphere and we breathe it. Trains, buses, trucks, cars, motobikes,  you name it, it used or uses asbestos in its brakes. Ever changed a flat tyre ? Then all the building materials. Demolition dust goes to atmosphere and we breath it. Etc... Try not to stress, contamination is modern life.

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## Abunai

Thank you for taking the time. 
I agree with the heart attack (and all the nasty things stress and lack of sleep can do to us) : my chest feels heavy since it happened... I know it's ridiculous but I must have developed an anxiety disorder due to my chronic illness. 
I could test a cloth sample indeed, it's about 70 euros so you're spot on Smurf. Testing the air is more like 400 euros but the lab guy told me it's useless, the windows in the contaminated room have been wide open for a week now. 
And you're right ringtail, we take risks every day by just being outside or eating apples... I guess that when we don't think about it or don't read about it, we're ok. And that's how companies can go on with selling toxic products. Asbestos is not the last scandal... But it's such a great one. Even Greeks in ancient times knew about the danger, jeez. 
But you know, when everything is going well and you realize what foolish mistake you just did... Well, you're just mad and feel guilty (and paranoid in my case). The whole flat has been totally renovated this winter (no asbestos elsewhere I promise !) with no drama ! 
Also the white and "curly" asbestos seems to not get completely stuck in our body, compared to other forms that are sharp. I would be very curious to know how many fibers we have in our lungs after accidental or everyday exposure.

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## intertd6

In a perfect world nobody should breathe in asbestos fibres, you have added to the normal exposure levels in your home, how far you want to go to protect your family is up to you, I'd be washing anything that could hold fibres & that means everything.
inter

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## johnc

For goodness sake, these were two 6mm holes, the dust was cleaned up immediately there would a minimal amount of dust left airborne if any, and most likely any that was airborne would have settled before the op returned. The op and his/her family have as close to no risk as you could get. We are talking about a bit of anxiety, which is fine but that does not excuse our over reactions raising an anxious persons fears which is unreasonable on our part. Before further posts appear can people put some further thought into what they write and not over dramatize the situation. 
Mind you, perhaps before spraying weeds, spray painting, breathing any air, starting a car or stationary engine essentially anything, perhaps we should just go through life wearing a hazmat suit and breathe only filtered air and ensure our skin is always covered, even in the shower. 
So please, read the original post, realise we are dealing with anxiety, not chronic exposure and temper responses accordingly.

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## PlatypusGardens

> perhaps before spraying weeds, spray painting, breathing any air, starting a car or stationary engine essentially anything, perhaps we should just go through life wearing a hazmat suit and breathe only filtered air and ensure our skin is always covered, even in the shower.

  Once, sitting around a backyard fire, somone chucked something plastic in the pit.
I forget what it was now but it was something small, like a TicTac box maybe 
One of the guys (with a cigarette in mouth) got up and took a few steps back to not inhale any of the toxic plastic fumes  :Rofl5:

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## David.Elliott

> Once, sitting around a backyard fire, somone chucked something plastic in the pit.
> I forget what it was now but it was something small, like a TicTac box maybe 
> One of the guys (with a cigarette in mouth) got up and took a few steps back to not inhale any of the toxic plastic fumes

  Nah, much more fun to put an unopened can of baked beans on it...see who moves away last...WINNER!

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## Abunai

> In a perfect world nobody should breathe in asbestos fibres, you have added to the normal exposure levels in your home, how far you want to go to protect your family is up to you, I'd be washing anything that could hold fibres & that means everything.
> inter

  That's what I'm trying to do. Not easy when there are thousands of items in the room, some of them impossible to wash completely (computers, books, etc).   

> For goodness sake, these were two 6mm holes, the dust was cleaned up immediately there would a minimal amount of dust left airborne if any, and most likely any that was airborne would have settled before the op returned.

  Nop  :Frown:  
I stayed in the closed room for 4 hours right after the drilling. I was assuming that the asbestos is only found in the obvious dust that falls down immediately. As nothing was covered with it, I thought it was ok. I had no idea it was so light and the real danger invisible. Until I started to read about it...  
 Well, the answers are quite reassuring, I'm just not ready to accept that this is not a issue at all and I don't feel well in my own flat. 
The fact that you can never tell if everything is clear and if you have some in your lungs is what scares me.  
An exposure outside with clothes I could easily throw away and nothing else contaminated would not have had the same effects.

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## phild01

If I had drilled those holes I wouldn't even have given it a second thought, done far worse.  The board also would unlikely have the worst type of fibre. 
Chrysotile Chrysotile This is the most commonly used form of asbestos and can be found today in roofs, ceilings, walls and floors of homes and businesses. Chrysotile asbestos also was used in automobile brake linings, pipe insulation, gaskets and boiler seals. Although it is more prevalent, some studies show it takes more exposure to chrysotile than other types of asbestos to develop related diseases. https://www.asbestos.com/asbestos/types/

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## Abunai

Yes it is probably white asbestos. 
But the thing is : you didn't drill those holes because you are not as dumb as me  :Wink:  
Again, an accidental and short exposure would not worry me at all if it was not inside, not in a room where pretty much everything I own and use was lying on the ground... 
Somehow, I know the risk is still very very low. I know the stress I'm going through could trigger much more nasty things (and soon, not in 30 years).  
But I really feel so dumb to drill into asbestos in 2017... It's not like we don't know. But well, actually we don't know that well. Many people around me told me they did renovations in their flat without even reading the asbestos report they got when they bought the property. 
I feel even more dumb because in 50 years, no hole had been drilled in this tiny wall. I had the information people didn't have before (a report is mandatory here every 3 years), and yet I do it. AND they are the only holes we drilled in the flat to hang a picture... No, those long and safe other walls were not attractive enough. Dumb from start to finish.

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## phild01

Honestly. I think you should just forget about it, not worth the stress.  Next time you know you will take more care for what is quite insignificant.

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## Marc

Have you made your will?

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## Abunai

ah ah I should. 
Next time I think I just won't buy a property if there is asbestos in it. Yes, that pretty much means a brand new house !

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## Marc

Relax mate ... 90% of the population has inhaled scores of asbestos fibres from car brakes.

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## Abunai

I know, I did for years when I was a kid and it was not banned yet. 
And many people must drill asbestos walls without realizing, even today. 
In a 2005 asbestos report for my flat, this wall was not even mentioned ! Meaning that the guy who bought it in 2005 had no idea. Like the ones before. 
And when I call the guy who made the new survey last year :  _Him : I'm 98 % sure it has asbestos
Me : so why don't you write "Asbestos be careful ! Do not disturb" in red letters ?
Him : because I don't legally have to test a sample, so I just write it is possibly asbestos even though I know it_ 
The guy does his job but doesn't give a @@@@ about what can happen. 
There is an asbestos pipe in another room. It is written on the 2005 report :_ "Do not disturb, avoid any contact. You may ask professional to remove it or encapsulate it"_.
This pipe ? The first day I moved in, I told my girlfriend : see this one ? we don't touch it, never ! 
But the wall, I didn't realize this could be a whole asbestos wall.

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## Sir Stinkalot

Wow .... this is going to get bigger than the Emission Trading and Climate Change tread. 
..... Abunai how about you tell us a little more about what your father was drilling 2x 6mm holes for. How big is your planned renovation? How has the discovery of this yet to be confirmed asbestos changed the plans for the renovation?

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## Abunai

For a stupid picture... The renovation is over, this wall is the only one made of asbestos and we never touched it before... The other rooms are fine.

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## PlatypusGardens

> see this one ? we don't touch it, never !
> .

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## Abunai

Exactly ! 
But the pipe, we never touched and never will (especially now...). The red letters in the report were scary and I'm scared easily as you see. 
On the opposite, nice blue letters for the wall were kind of saying : "Ok, it might have asbestos, but we don't know where exactly, we don't know how much. Well, we're not even sure, it's a wall, why would a nice white wall be that dangerous in your cosy home and cost you your sleep ?"

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## pharmaboy2

> Have you made your will?

  Lol, johnc got it right above as well. 
DSM-6 needs a new one - AEA. Asbestos exposure induced anxiety  
at these times, take the advice from the front page of the hitchhikers guide to the galaxy - there will be another thread on this topic  before the end of May, see you all then.....

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## joynz

> Exactly ! 
> But the pipe, we never touched and never will (especially now...). The red letters in the report were scary and I'm scared easily as you see. 
> On the opposite, nice blue letters for the wall were kind of saying : "Ok, it might have asbestos, but we don't know where exactly, we don't know how much. Well, we're not even sure, it's a wall, why would a nice white wall be that dangerous in your cosy home and cost you your sleep ?"

  I am still surprised ( amazed, really) that you ignored the building report comment that the wall may contain asbestos.  
Even if it was written in blue!

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## Abunai

Jesus man, I feel bad enough, what's the point ? 
I didn't just ignore it, things are always a little bit more complicated in reality. That's what we call an accident (that's how some high-skilled people can still crash an airliner and kill hundreds, you know : several little mistakes that no one sees coming and make for the perfect disaster recipe). I said I feel stupid enough I think... 
Anyway, I appreciate the other guys making fun of my anxiety  :Blush7:

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## METRIX

Well here is a lesson for life, don't hoard so much stuff in one room, I think you should throw everything out that was in the room, come to think about it I would also sell your place and move to a safe house, you are certain to get mesothelioma in a short period, possibly even next week.  
In your new Safe house, buy all new thousands of items, but this time spread it all into the other rooms and minimize your future risk.

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## Abunai

Will do. But are you sure about the new house ? I mean, I already know I'm doomed, is it worth the hassle ?

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## METRIX

> Will do. But are you sure about the new house ? I mean, I already know I'm doomed, is it worth the hassle ?

  
Sure, 
I would be more concerned about the thousands of things you say are in this room, with all the plastics and various chemicals that went into producing them constantly off gassing toxic chemicals into your room.
A little Asbestos dust is the least of your worries.

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## sol381

indeed.. funny to hear some people worry about asbestosis while sucking on  50 cigarettes a day.. Youre worried about what now.

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## Marc

Worrying is what makes you sick ... the correct term is hypochondria. 
Now man, stop worrying and vote Le Pen ... all your worries will be over then, out of the european union, and high fences all around France. Come to think of it, they could make the feces with asbestos to discourage braking though ... now that is a good idea or what?

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## Abunai

I like the cigarettes comparison but I don't smoke, never did and never will. I'm boring actually : exercise, no alcohol, eat healthy... 
About Le Pen... Well, no  :Wink:

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## Sir Stinkalot

Almost time for a group hug I'm thinking.

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## Abunai

What for ? To celebrate my soon-to-come death ? 
And the coming death of all the people I meet, as my clothes will never be washed completely.

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## Marc

R.I.P.
His father drilled a hole in asbestos and spread some asbestos fibres in his flat.
Cleaning up the mess, he was holding his breath not to inhale the fibres.
He got dizzy and fell down the stairs.
He crawled to the phone for help and forgot he left dinner on the stove. Before the ambulance could arrive the flat bursted in flames
He dragged himself out of the flat and jumped in the pool but forgot the pool was empty.
The ambulance arrived just in time to take him to hospital but got hit by a meteorite on the way to the hospital.
On his epitaph we can read
"Died from asbestos fibre inhalation"

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## Abunai

BUT Le Pen was not made President this year. So he could rest in peace really  :Blush7:  
Brilliant story by the way  :Wink:

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## PlatypusGardens

:Runaway:

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## sol381

indeed PG

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## Abunai

So guys, my funeral will be held soon. You may have to wear a mask if you want to come. 
For those who want a gift before that, I can offer some nice North Face clothes (for free but asbestos not free of course), for instance. There are also DVDs and books which are deadly good.

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## sol381

soon eh.. thought asbestosis took 40 years to kill.

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## Abunai

Yes, but I'm an impatient person. The sooner the better (I may have to help the natural process of death to speed up of course).

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## intertd6

I don't see what the problem is, if it was a workplace & had been contaminated the whole place would be washed & vacuumed, anything that could be washed would be & anything that couldn't would be disposed of properly, why wouldn't you do the same thing to protect your family from an added risk they don't need?
inter

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## Abunai

Because this is not a workplace and everything I own was in the room. 
That's not so easy to bin everything... Especially if you don't know if you HAVE to do it or not. 
The place has been washed twice, vacuumed and the clothes washed twice (in a regular machine). But no one can say for sure if it's enough. Everyone tells me so, but who knows for sure ? I can't test every single piece of clothes in the lab. 
I've had a huge trauma in my life recently, getting rid of everything I own is not easy and adds to the misery. 
I just wish it didn't happen (OR someone tells me there is no asbestos, but it's 99 % certain).

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## PlatypusGardens

Seriously.....is this a wind-up or what?

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## SilentButDeadly

> Once, sitting around a backyard fire, somone chucked something plastic in the pit.
> I forget what it was now but it was something small, like a TicTac box maybe 
> One of the guys (with a cigarette in mouth) got up and took a few steps back to not inhale any of the toxic plastic fumes

  I remember that. Half asleep, nice and warm, slightly soaked in red wine, an ongoing burble of pointless yet amusing conversation. And some bastard dropped a box of subsonic .22 calibre bullets on the fire.

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## Abunai

No, seriously I'm not a troll. 
I'm just someone who has a tough chronic illness and who can't take much more worries.

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## plum

> So guys, my funeral will be held soon. You may have to wear a mask if you want to come. 
> For those who want a gift before that, I can offer some nice North Face clothes (for free but asbestos not free of course), for instance. There are also DVDs and books which are deadly good.

  Don't go the cremation, with all that asbestos in your system, you will not burn.

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## Abunai

Hence the mask if you want to come to the show  :Tongue:  
Seriously, I may have a last question...  
Would you feel ok with your clothes after washing them at home ? I don't for now...

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## PlatypusGardens

> Half asleep, nice and warm, slightly soaked in red wine, an ongoing burble of pointless yet amusing conversation.

  So....much like the time we spend here on Renovate Forum?

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## SilentButDeadly

> So....much like the time we spend here on Renovate Forum?

  Now that you point it out...yes!

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## SilentButDeadly

> Hence the mask if you want to come to the show  
> Seriously, I may have a last question...  
> Would you feel ok with your clothes after washing them at home ? I don't for now...

  Yes.........

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## Spottiswoode

> Anyway, I appreciate the other guys making fun of my anxiety

   In Australia making fun of people is a national sport. If there is anxiety involved you get bonus points. If it's on the internet however, the keyboard anonymity can perhaps push things a little bit far.

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## PlatypusGardens

> If it's on the internet however, the keyboard anonymity can perhaps push things a little bit far.

  
Works both ways.
I've seen plenty of wind-up threads on all kinds of topics and forums where the OP asks a question and keeps asking for clarification after dozens of people have already answered their question from every angle possible. 
In all fairness we still don't know for sure if this is one of them.
And nobody will ever be able to prove or disprove it. 
Either way I think it's gone on long enough and there's nothing anyone here can do to help this guy with his anxiety.   :Smilie:

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## johnc

> Hence the mask if you want to come to the show  
> Seriously, I may have a last question...  
> Would you feel ok with your clothes after washing them at home ? I don't for now...

  Yes, absolutely, you have run them through the machine twice which will remove anything that needs to be removed. Seriously there is nothing for you to worry about.

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## Marc

My choice of prescription is Diazepam 10 mg 3 times a day for 3 years. If symptom persist, keep on taking it.

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## Abunai

Thanks again.  
It's not a wind-up thread, even though I can understand it looks like one.  
I'm the first one to be unable to understand why this accident matters so much to me.

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## phild01

Abunai, get a grip, more important things for you to get on with. Close to closing this one off.

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## PlatypusGardens

:What he said:

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## Marc

Another very good therapy without the drugs, is Cryotherapy. Look it up, there is bound to be one near you. Very good for recovery from trauma, depression etc. My son in law opened a Cryotherapy place in Liverpool Sydney. 
A bit far to come regularly but if you decide to visit to clear your head, we'll stick you in subzero chamber for a few minutes and you will feel another person altogether ...  :Smilie:   https://www.facebook.com/subzeroaus/?hc_ref=NEWSFEED

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## sol381

Do you bulk bill Dr. Marc

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## Marc

Ha ha, group discounts apply, and no, it's not my business. 
I helped him setting up, we built the partitions inside a gym for them to get started and one of my in law did the electrical part.

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## PhilT2

There's no better cure for a non existent problem than a therapy that doesn't work. https://skeptoid.com/blog/2014/11/30...d-what-doesnt/

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## PlatypusGardens

> There's no better cure for a non existent problem than a therapy that doesn't work.

   :Rofl5:

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## Abunai

Can you keep me and my family in the cryotherapy thing until an asbestos cure is found ?  :Yikes2:

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## Spottiswoode

> Can you keep me and my family in the cryotherapy thing until an asbestos cure is found ?

  No need, there is a cure for minor exposure, although not many people like the taste of a cup of concrete. Doesn't work on chronic exposure though.

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## Marc

Mm ... I think you are confusing Cryotherapy with Cryonics. 
For the latter you will need to be legally dead. 
The former is very popular in Europe and used by professional athletes the world over with very good results.
In your case it may assist in revitalise the parts of your body that have started to look pale limp and lifeless and give you back that pink healthy tone  :Rofl5:

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## JustPassingBy

You know, last year in October, we discovered that all the walls in our house are covered with plaster which contains asbestos. Not sheets, really a plaster finish with asbestos mixed into it. We are living here for 6 years, already drilled numerous wholes in our walls at various places...  
We also have asbestos insulation around our heating pipes. We also did not know that this was asbestos before October last year... Because here in Belgium, people are uninformed and there is no obligation whatsoever to perform any asbestos research when selling a house. A lot, and it is really A LOT, of the Belgian population has no clue of what they are dealing with. 
On the plaster for instance: I let the lab investigate the sample, which contains chrysotile (I don't know which percentage, cause labs may not disclose that to "regular" people). She stated that it is not that uncommon that asbestos is found in plaster. Yet, few samples are being taken from private persons' homes, as there is no obligation to do so.  
I let an asbestos removal company into my house to check this out, still ignorant of the financial implications... he made an offer of 50.000 EUR to remove the plaster from our walls. But I don't want to discuss the issue from the financial angle. So he explained that apparently, the application of asbestos in plaster is something the sector and government only "recently" discovered (couple of years)... and there is no public disclosure of that.  
So, I took a personal test and asked several people about it:
- Three contractors, specialized in renovations (read: breaking down walls on a daily basis): none ever heard of it
- Numerous (20+) "regular" individuals (people who renovated their homes): only 1 vaguely recalled hearing about this
- Two firms, specialised in plasterwork (read: breaking down walls on a daily basis): one, the one already operating for 50+ years (family business), never heard of it. The other one stated that "it has been rumoured, but never officially proven, that plaster could contain asbestos" (yeah @@@@ myself, I have it in my god damned walls)
- A real estate broker: never heard of it
- An architect, working for 7 years, 75% of his work are renovations: never heard of it 
The point that I want to make here is that one should not be concerned about two @@@@ing little 6mm holes, but about all the asbestos that is unknowingly being released in the air because of misconduct by our government. People are being desinformed and it all doesn't make sense. In Belgium, you are obliged to have most types of asbestos professionally removed, yet there is no obligation to have your material tested nor is there any sensibilisation of which materials could contain asbestos. I don't have to draw a picture on what happens on a daily basis, right?  
It is just all so... hopeless.  
And asbestos is just 1 contaminant. Think about glyfosate, lead paint, nano-particals, polyurethane, diesel particals, other fine dusts, radon, radio-activity,... It would be very hypocrite to be anxcious about only one thing, while our whole environment is contaminated. This is modern live. I don't get me wrong, I am still anxcious about it myself (I was very anxcious, including panic attacks and the whole lot, for three weeks after "the discovery"), but more so VERY angry.

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