# Forum Home Renovation Stairs, Steps and Ramps  External Stairs - not happy with work - advice please

## merecat

Hi guys, 
Just seeking a little bit of advice so I can hopefully negotiate with a builder with some confidence please. I have tried to attach some pics to illustrate but am not sure if it worked  :Smilie:  
I just had new front stairs and some repairs done to backstairs.Got some dot points below outlining what I think the main issues are: 
1. bottom of front stairs just sitting on pavers. I expected them to be set on concrete or something, plus there is nothing resembling and capping or proofing. I am in Brisbane and thought this to be standard. Any thoughts? 
2. builder told me half way through job that as bottom landing and stairs were under 1m off ground they didn't need railing. He quoted for and I wanted railings but he would not enter into a conversation, and he is now demanding full payment ASAP. I personally think they look unfinished and potentially a bit dangerous for people unfamiliar with stairs.  
3. The top railing looks stupid with the little extension, I had not been specific enough with specifications but have never seen a rail done like this, do you think I have grounds for asking him to re-do with out the massive visable screws and with a neat angle at the corner? 
4. to me the stairs seem crooked, I did some measurements and it looks like there is 4cm difference from where the stairs finish (left is 'shorter') and most of that seems to be in the last 2 stairs. Is this something that sometime happens? I think I can live with it, I just wanted to know. 
5. back stairs. Aparently he told my tennant that he would be back to finish the stair repair at the back, I am not sure what the hell this mess is but apart from looking terrible, the second step from the bottom has no support and the bottom step is narrower that the second last making it uncomfprtable to walk down, plus the rise on the bottom two steps is different fromt he rest of the stairs, much 'taller' the ols stairs have 16 cm between, the second last has 19cm and the last has a 24cm drop. Can anyone advise? I tought if nothing else thay should all be as close as possible? 
OK, sorry for such as long post but any thoughts or advice on how to negotiate a reasonable job on this and what is me being too finisky would be much appreciated. 
Thank you  :Smilie:

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## Bedford

> He quoted for and I wanted railings but he would not enter into a conversation, and he is now demanding full payment ASAP. I personally think they look unfinished and potentially a bit dangerous for people unfamiliar with stairs.

   Is this quote in writing?     

> 4. to me the stairs seem crooked, I did some measurements and it looks like there is 4cm difference from where the stairs finish (left is 'shorter') and most of that seems to be in the last 2 stairs. Is this something that sometime happens? I think I can live with it, I just wanted to know.

   No, It shouldn't happen.   

> 5. back stairs. Aparently he told my tennant that he would be back to finish the stair repair at the back, I am not sure what the hell this mess is but apart from looking terrible, the second step from the bottom has no support and the bottom step is narrower that the second last making it uncomfprtable to walk down, plus the rise on the bottom two steps is different fromt he rest of the stairs, much 'taller' the ols stairs have 16 cm between, the second last has 19cm and the last has a 24cm drop. Can anyone advise? I tought if nothing else thay should all be as close as possible?

   What he's done here is just rubbish.   

> OK, sorry for such as long post but any thoughts or advice on how to negotiate a reasonable job on this and what is me being too finisky would be much appreciated.

   I would not pay him, but I would contact this mob and seek their advice.  Building Services Authority, QLD (BSA)

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## ringtail

Looks a bit crap all round to me. The timber for the handrail ( at least) looks like F14, which will warp, twist and shrink in the next year so be prepared. The little overhang of the handrail is quite a common way to do this style, although it could have been finished a lot better. All rises must be the same on each flight and must comply with the BCA. All new work or substantial repairs must comply with the BCA. Your stairs do not comply. Did you sign a contract ? If not the builder is in breach. There should have been a variation for the changes ( to balustrade) which he should have presented to you. Are the stairs to be painted or clear finished ? There appears to be no primer  anywhere ? The balustrade for the top flight and landing are totally illegal if higher than 1 mt from natural ground. Just tell the builder that the job must comply with the BCA and as it does not, you are not paying him until he makes good. Call the BSA and ask for advice, but always give the contractor the opportunity to rectify the work first. If he wont play ball and be reasonable, then go to the BSA at West End and complain in person. They will send an inspector out who will then take whatever action is required to get you the result that you deserve. You are not been too picky at all.

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## merecat

Thanks guys, I am sending him the pics and questions / rectifications similar to the stuff in this post and trying to word it firmly but but not unreasonably as I would of course rather it fixed amicably than having to go go through with a compaint, so I will see how it goes. There is a written quote, but in retrospect it was not as detailed as it should have been (live and learn...). 
I have asked for specifications on the wood used as well. 
I had planned to paint the balustrade to match the house which is being done in 2 weeks but clear finish the tread and decking (was going to ask painter for advice on this, but if you have a better idea, please let me know). 
No there is no primer on anything. 
Cheers

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## ringtail

There should be primer or a clear sealer ( if clear finishing) on the house outs for the stair treads, all end grain cuts and all joins. This is a major problem that only high lights the laziness of some chippies. Back in the old days ( lol) a chippy would have a tin of primer next to him at all times. How hard is it to have 4 lt of oil based primer and 4 lt of clear sealer in the truck. They will last for ages, and the customer ultimately pays for it anyway.If you are going to clear finish the treads and stringers, get some product on it ASAP and flood it into the house outs for the treads before it rains again.

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## merecat

Thanks Ringtail, I'll have to get on to it ASAP, it's due to rain later this week...

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## SabreOne

Merecat, 
Your concerns are valid, and you don't need to be a builder to see what has been done on the back steps is rubbish. Give him the opportunity to rectify it, and try to resolve amicably if possible. 
Cheers
SabreOne

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## merecat

Yeah, will definitely try to resolve amicably, I'm not keen to file a complaint, & he has already promised to fix some things, and has ensured there is termite treatment on the wood, so that is a start. There now seems to be a plan for the back I guess I will see how that goes. Thanks for the input guys and apologies for my aweful typing! I can't belive I didn't read and fix all the typos  :Smilie:

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