# Forum More Stuff Owner Builders Forum  Is the OB course worthwhile for non-OBs?

## Pete F

I have an extension some time in the future I MAY do as an OB, and will of course need to do the OB/White Card courses if I go down that path. I still haven't decided how I'll approach that yet. Until then I wondered if those who have done the OB course feel there would be value in doing it before then? I'm completing renovations of increasing size and complexity, but none currently trigger the OB requirement. I do pretty much all work myself and don't need external contractors/trades.  
I've seen a basic outline of the topics covered but not the detail of the courses. With only so much brain space available I don't know if it's better to knock that course off now, and will do so if there's information of real value to what I do now. On the other hand it may be better to wait until I actually need to do it, and spend the time learning about the more nuts 'n' bolts side of the projects as I knock them off. 
I'd be grateful for thoughts and experiences with those who have done the course.

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## OBBob

I have not done the course because it isn't required in Victoria. However, I've heard that it is mostly to do with insurance requirements, engaging trades, contracts, etc. I reckon you always learn something... but it probably depends how much it costs and your free time.  
The other thing worth checking would be if you need to have done the course within a certain time of becoming an OB. It'd be frustrating to have to do it again because you did it too early.

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## Pete F

Thanks Bob, it's not required in Vic? Wow, ok. 
The cost would be somewhere around $180-$250, not a poke in the eye, but not a show-stopper either if it's worthwhile. I'm always flat-out, so if I do something it will always mean I can't do something else. On the other hand if it's useful right now, I'll put something else off to do it as it will probably need to be done eventually. As far as I'm aware it can be done any time before seeking OB approval, but it's something I will confirm with the provide before shelling out the hard-earned.

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## m6sports

It's not worth the money you pay for it, I did mine to do OB and its a crock. It's just there to make money as the online courses give you the answers in the questions. If they were serious about it it should be a one day course or better still 1 week with some hands on

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## Marc

Just a tool to get as many as possible buying "insurance" ... only a misnomer for something you pay for so that a future owner can chase you and that will never cover anyone for anything at all.

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## OBBob

> Just a tool to get as many as possible buying "insurance" ... only a misnomer for something you pay for so that a future owner can chase you and that will never cover anyone for anything at all.

  ha ha ... a funny observation given that in Victoria the course isn't compulsory but the insurance is.

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## Pete F

Ok thanks guys, I'd suspected as much, hence the question. I spoke with a colleague who'd done it quite a while ago and was surprised that he said it was worthwhile. However he did it through TAFE and I suspect they included a lot of information that wasn't required but was more of practical value. He'd also be the first to admit he can't drive a nail in straight, so subbed the whole build out, and maybe the info there was of use to his situation. I have lot of respect for him and mentioned I thought it was a gutsy move by him to not have any background, experience or even interest in any building, reno, or even hands-on DIY work, but it just goes to show that OBs come from all different backgrounds. Personally I'd like to always have a gut feel as to whether the job looked like it was being done right and according to code even if it wasn't my trade or experience, but in his case he was a project manager and never lifted, nor had any interest in lifting, a hammer in anger. 
Sounds like I should pass on the course until it's actually needed.

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## NRB

I did it some years ago,not required but I think it was good value.
Plenty of ideas of what not to do and lots of books and planning info.like pricing range,estimating and time line plans.
Good for me,my job when well made some mistakes but nothing too bad.
If you do it or not,take a walk around some building sites and have a look in the waste skips,just bloody disgraceful how much(money) goes to the tip,on my job I gave the trades my planning logic and no extra.eg.eves lining sheets this is how many sheets you have and this is how you use them.
You may say that I was a PIA but it's my money and when I talked to the guys doing the job this way I had no problems,they were a great lots of guys

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## Pete F

Interesting, ok thanks for the opinion and experience. 
Yes it's disgraceful the wastage in the industry and it's ironic you mentioned it as I was just thinking about the same thing last night. On the one hand I get it and why it happens, but on the other hand it's terrible to see. It's one advantage of doing work myself in that I will save what I didn't use and it normally gets used for something useful further along the track. Eventually I have a bit of a clean out and turf out products that have expired etc, but at least they get a chance in the meanwhile.

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## commodorenut

About 10 years back, a lot of NSW industry started demanding white cards before letting people on site, so my work decided that everyone who had reason to go out on site for anything, would be sent for their white card. 
I did my white card at a nearby NSW TAFE.  A few hours of "death by powerpoint" then a lunch break, then the "exam" which was as easy as pie.  
Apart from myself, the entire "class" was a diverse range of tradies - tilers, a couple of chippies, some brickies, and a few sparkies.  Their level of English went from excellent, to on the verge of needing an interpreter.  Age range was basically apprentice right through to retiree. 
I found little relevance to my line of work (industrial sites & factory plant) as it was heavily slanted towards the OB and tradie type of person.
They spent more time dwelling on what was acceptable as a site toilet, with a plethora of example photos of what wasn't.... than they did about hearing protection.... 
They did provide good info that I've taken on board myself - like running extension cords, basic electrical lockouts, and the basics of working off ladders or platforms - but not a huge amount of detail into each. 
In the end, it was really all common-sense stuff, and very little of it would benefit the OB, as they didn't really cover anything about contracts, estimates of work, what trade looks after what etc.  It was all about site "safety" and IMO, site "comfort" to appease the unionist. 
Despite being given an hour, and warned that some guys run out of time, I did the exam in about 10 minutes, handed it in, got full marks, and was allowed to leave.  A few weeks later the card arrived in the post.

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## CheeseAndWine

I did it last year as a compulsory course in order to get my DA. I was a complete waste of time. for me at least. All about insurance, work cover, safety hats and boots, providing toilets and smoko area for workers, and more of the same in 10 different ways. There was a tiny tiny bit about working out material quantities but not to any useful detail. I don't really recall anything useful in terms of actually planning or building.

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## joynz

> About 10 years back, a lot of NSW industry started demanding white cards before letting people on site, so my work decided that everyone who had reason to go out on site for anything, would be sent for their white card. 
> I did my white card at a nearby NSW TAFE.  A few hours of "death by powerpoint" then a lunch break, then the "exam" which was as easy as pie.  
> Apart from myself, the entire "class" was a diverse range of tradies - tilers, a couple of chippies, some brickies, and a few sparkies.  Their level of English went from excellent, to on the verge of needing an interpreter.  Age range was basically apprentice right through to retiree. 
> I found little relevance to my line of work (industrial sites & factory plant) as it was heavily slanted towards the OB and tradie type of person.
> They spent more time dwelling on what was acceptable as a site toilet, with a plethora of example photos of what wasn't.... than they did about hearing protection.... 
> They did provide good info that I've taken on board myself - like running extension cords, basic electrical lockouts, and the basics of working off ladders or platforms - but not a huge amount of detail into each. 
> In the end, it was really all common-sense stuff, and very little of it would benefit the OB, as they didn't really cover anything about contracts, estimates of work, what trade looks after what etc.  It was all about site "safety" and IMO, site "comfort" to appease the unionist. 
> Despite being given an hour, and warned that some guys run out of time, I did the exam in about 10 minutes, handed it in, got full marks, and was allowed to leave.  A few weeks later the card arrived in the post.

  I did my white card at HIA in Melbourne a couple of years ago.  Took a whole day.  Was quite useful.  Lots of stuff on safety gear, risk assessment, swms et. 
It is required in order to enter building sites so there were a few new labourers and other people with new jobs that require going onto building sites.  It's not actually a building course, it is meant to ensure that you have a good safety grounding so you go home alive!  My course definitely did that. 
There was no mention of toilets at all.

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## PlatypusGardens

> I have not done the course .

   
Yet you call yourself OB Bob?
Liar!   :Shock:

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## OBBob

> Yet you call yourself OB Bob?
> Liar!

  Lol... I have the certificate though. I must be an honorary OB.   :Biggrin:

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## commodorenut

> I did it last year as a compulsory course  in order to get my DA.

   

> I did my white card at HIA in Melbourne a couple of years ago.

  Sounds like ACT is very similar to NSW (even with a 10 year gap), but VIC is a bit different - preferring real safety rather than 75 different ways to provide a site toilet.

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## PlatypusGardens

> Lol... I have the certificate though. I must be an honorary OB.

  
Sure you do... "Bob".....assuming that is your real name  :Sneaky2:

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## OBBob

> Sure you do... "Bob".....assuming that is your real name

  Bla Bla bla... I also have the manual!

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## PlatypusGardens

:Rofl5:

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## JB1

> I have not done the course because it isn't required in Victoria. However, I've heard that it is mostly to do with insurance requirements, engaging trades, contracts, etc. I reckon you always learn something... but it probably depends how much it costs and your free time.  
> The other thing worth checking would be if you need to have done the course within a certain time of becoming an OB. It'd be frustrating to have to do it again because you did it too early.

  In Victoria it's changed since last year I believe. I'm going through it now to get my OB permit. Much harder getting a permit compared to years ago. 
You now have to sit an online OB assessment which actually educational as you learn about certificates, building notice/orders etc, this is free. 
In addition, you have to go on a 1 day training course with a TAFE or Registered Training Organisation to get your white card (can't be done online). I went the RTO route. It was all about safety and nothing to do with OB.  
At least the white card will last a lifetime.

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## OBBob

> In Victoria it's changed since last year I believe. I'm going through it now to get my OB permit. Much harder getting a permit compared to years ago. 
> You now have to sit an online OB assessment which actually educational as you learn about certificates, building notice/orders etc, this is free. 
> In addition, you have to go on a 1 day training course with a TAFE or Registered Training Organisation to get your white card (can't be done online). I went the RTO route. It was all about safety and nothing to do with OB.  
> At least the white card will last a lifetime.

  Interesting. I must've just slipped in before this with my last one.

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## METRIX

I believe it's also changed in NSW, someone I know did it a few years ago, I happened to be over there at the time, she come out and said can you have a look at this question, yeah sure I said. 
It asked to number from 1-15 the steps involved in erecting a structure, such as windows, frames, roof, guttering etc, her answers were all over the shop, so I said no change 4 for 7, 2 for 5 etc etc, then she said OHH this is too hard, and clicked a question mark, the answers popped up, I said what did you do she said you just hit this and the answers come up. 
OMG I said what a waste of time that is, anyway she passed and got her OB, what a joke. 
Someone told me they changed the format and it now takes many hours to pass it with no answers given !! not sure

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## OBBob

> I believe it's also changed in NSW, someone I know did it a few years ago, I happened to be over there at the time, she come out and said can you have a look at this question, yeah sure I said. 
> It asked to number from 1-15 the steps involved in erecting a structure, such as windows, frames, roof, guttering etc, her answers were all over the shop, so I said no change 4 for 7, 2 for 5 etc etc, then she said OHH this is too hard, and clicked a question mark, the answers popped up, I said what did you do she said you just hit this and the answers come up. 
> OMG I said what a waste of time that is, anyway she passed and got her OB, what a joke. 
> Someone told me they changed the format and it now takes many hours to pass it with no answers given !! not sure

  I don't think it was ever really intended to allow us to actually build our own houses... more like contract at a lower level and project manage. Anyway, some of us do... eek.

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