# Forum Home Renovation Solar Electrical Systems  Skylights

## barnes

Thinking of installing a few. There is a choice between the traditional skylights or the illume ones. Say a few words on your experience. Which is better. Pros and cons. Thank you in advance.

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## OBBob

I'm about to put some illumes in. Love the idea, reviews are good... time will tell but I'm happy to take a point in technology.   :Biggrin:   
Worth noting I have a few physical limitations that support the faux-skylight option too.

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## barnes

> I'm about to put some illumes in. Love the idea, reviews are good... time will tell but I'm happy to take a point in technology.    
> Worth noting I have a few physical limitations that support the faux-skylight option too.

  Can you share what kind of illumes you choose? And what your expectations are (how many square meters are you going to give light to, how high are your ceilings), if you don't mind.

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## OBBob

> Can you share what kind of illumes you choose? And what your expectations are (how many square meters are you going to give light to, how high are your ceilings), if you don't mind.

  I haven't chosen yet but I'm likely to go something like two of the 400mm square version. It's only an ensuite and walk-in robe (total about 8msq) so I'm happy for a bit of a risk on this working sufficiently. I'll probably go the 'premium' version because the cable is bigger and longer and you get a bit more light output from the led panel. That size says it puts out around 1000 lumens at the lower end, which seems heaps since I have an 800 lumen batten globe in a 12sqm room and it's plenty bright.  
I really love roof windows and had big ones in the last house (even triple glazed you can get a lot of heat transfer). However, it became apparent that because of the proximity to the neighbours I'd probably have a blind on it most of the time (or frost it), plus there is a lot more roof (framing, bracing, plumbing) work for a window, plus sound and heat transfer, plus possible moisture issues in a bathroom. So that's how I ended up where I am.

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## OBBob

Oh ... 2.4m ceilings.

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## mudbrick

Roof windows need plumbing how? I have an old Velux and it leaks like a sieve, which surprises me a bit given the amount of flashing around it.

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## barnes

> Roof windows need plumbing how? I have an old Velux and it leaks like a sieve, which surprises me a bit given the amount of flashing around it.

  I see you have problems with the traditional one? There is no way you can stop the leaking?

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## OBBob

> Roof windows need plumbing how? I have an old Velux and it leaks like a sieve, which surprises me a bit given the amount of flashing around it.

  I meant it makes more work for the roof plumber in a new build.  
Is your roof low pitch?

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## mudbrick

Nothing has worked so far though I adjjt I haven't ripped all the flashing off and started again which would probably be best.
Low pitch yes 15 degree only

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## barnes

> I meant it makes more work for the roof plumber in a new build.  
> Is your roof low pitch?

  What about mine - 22,5, is it low?

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## FrodoOne

> Thinking of installing a few. There is a choice between the traditional skylights or the illume ones. Say a few words on your experience. Which is better. Pros and cons. Thank you in advance.

  After tracing up the reference I found that "Illume" is a trade name for one brand of LED Solar Powered "Skylight". (Just as "Thermos" is a brand of vacuum flask, "Panadol" is a brand of paracetamol etc.) 
One learns something new every day!

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## OBBob

> After tracing up the reference I found that "Illume" is a trade name for one brand of LED Solar Powered "Skylight". (Just as "Thermos" is a brand of vacuum flask, "Panadol" is a brand of paracetamol etc.) 
> One learns something new every day!

  Yes, most common version in Australia but there are others globally.

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## OBBob

> What about mine - 22,5, is it low?

  That's not too bad.

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## barnes

> After tracing up the reference I found that "Illume" is a trade name for one brand of LED Solar Powered "Skylight". (Just as "Thermos" is a brand of vacuum flask, "Panadol" is a brand of paracetamol etc.) 
> One learns something new every day!

  As a guy who lived in the States all through the 70s I call kids diapers - Pampers, buy the name of the company that started them or made them popular, the same is with Xerox.  :Smilie:

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## OBBob

> As a guy who lived in the States all through the 70s I call kids diapers - Pampers, buy the name of the company that started them or made them popular, the same is with Xerox.

  Lol... but they're not called daipers here, they're called nappies.   :Biggrin:   
Anyway, no roof angle issues with solar skylights.   :Biggrin:

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## johnc

We have two Velux skylights on a near flat roof (clip lock) One small leak in eight years and that was just a matter of  another coat of sealing goo, sometimes leaks around skylights aren't the skylight but can be a nearby valley or leak that simply comes out through the base of the skylight after running along the ceiling sheet. We also have a couple of tube skylights that are quite good and bring in a lot of light, certainly much more than the traditional 600mm square cover with tunnel they replaced.

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## mudbrick

Do the tube type lights let much heat in ? I could do with one of those. Is there any issues with skylights and colourbond roofing ?

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## FrodoOne

> Do the tube type lights let much heat in ? I could do with one of those. Is there any issues with skylights and colourbond roofing ?

  Tube lights will "let in" significant heat only if the outside fitting faces North (or West).  Obviously, this is because, at certain times of day, the sun could then shine directly into them and into the house.
If they face South, only sky-light will enter, that is quite bright enough and will not heat the house! 
This is written with the experience of three existing South-facing Sky-lights - two Tube-Lights and one "full" sky-light.  However they are all in a tiled roof, so I cannot comment concerning colourbond roofing.

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## OBBob

^ WHS... In one of my past places I put a couple of roof windows on the north side. I thought I was doing the right thing because capturing north light is important right? In reality I would've got plenty of light from the south without the huge heat transfer of the north (even thought they were triple glazed). Always learning.   :Biggrin:

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## METRIX

I have done a few illume's and they work great, recently did the 600x600 manhole replacement type, it lit up like a football stadium. 
I have a 350mm round in the laundry and it lights the whole room up, 5x3m, it has no natural light as it's under the house. 
Be sure to place the solar cell so it' has no trees to obstruct it. 
I still like the idea of seeing out the window, but most let in heaps of summer heat if placed on the wrong size, they get dirty, and can leak, illume solves all those problems.

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## OBBob

> I have done a few illume's and they work great, recently did the 600x600 manhole replacement type, it lit up like a football stadium. 
> I have a 350mm round in the laundry and it lights the whole room up, 5x3m, it has no natural light as it's under the house. 
> Be sure to place the solar cell so it' has no trees to obstruct it. 
> I still like the idea of seeing out the window, but most let in heaps of summer heat if placed on the wrong size, they get dirty, and can leak, illume solves all those problems.

  Glad to hear real feedback, thanks!

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## OBBob

Do you think you can have too much light? I'm deciding between 400mm and 600mm in a room that's about 4sqm... I'm thinking perhaps the smaller is sufficient? I want plenty of light but don't want to be dazzled even time I walk in there.

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## METRIX

These also dim and brighten as the clouds go over, they are very white LED in them, I would have preferred a slight yellow tinge but you don't notice it after a week, 
On overcast days they are not at full brightness but that the same as a normal skylight, 
They now have internal windows, stock sizes up to 600x122 or custom to whatever you want.
There is also an option to hook a plug pack onto them and switch them onto full brightness whenever you want, so you can replace ceiling light in the room with this, and simply switch it on at night.

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## METRIX

> Do you think you can have too much light? I'm deciding between 400mm and 600mm in a room that's about 4sqm... I'm thinking perhaps the smaller is sufficient? I want plenty of light but don't want to be dazzled even time I walk in there.

  They are fairly bright, with massive beam spread,  
They have retail and premium versions, see below for lumen's of each model. 
4sqm is a tiny room, a 600mm will burn your eyes out  :Biggrin:

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## OBBob

Yes, I plan on the premium for the longer cable. The other thing you can do is order a set with say three internal panels and a larger single solar panel. Easier to install and they all operate together.

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## METRIX

The round ones are more efficient for a given size,  
Don't tell Phil, as he loves Square things

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## OBBob

Square will suit better in this instance... but generally I prefer to avoid the aligning issues that come with square.  :eek:

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## phild01

Don't get me wrong as I like the idea of solar power but if you leave a 13w led light on for half a day every day, it would take 25 years to break even with the cost of a 400x400 illume.  I think the comparison is fair because that's all you are getting, led light.  Natural light can't be beaten IMO. 
edit: just noticed Metrix's comment, should have done a round comparison :Biggrin:

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## barnes

> These also dim and brighten as the clouds go over, they are very white LED in them, I would have preferred a slight yellow tinge but you don't notice it after a week, 
> On overcast days they are not at full brightness but that the same as a normal skylight, 
> They now have internal windows, stock sizes up to 600x122 or custom to whatever you want.
> There is also an option to hook a plug pack onto them and switch them onto full brightness whenever you want, so you can replace ceiling light in the room with this, and simply switch it on at night.

  
Do you have any experience on how long will the solar panel last?

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## OBBob

> Do you have any experience on how long will the solar panel last?

  Design life is around 18 years I believe. That doesn't mean it'll fail at 18 years though.

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## OBBob

> Don't get me wrong as I like the idea of solar power but if you leave a 13w led light on for half a day every day, it would take 25 years to break even with the cost of a 400x400 illume.  I think the comparison is fair because that's all you are getting, led light.  Natural light can't be beaten IMO. 
> edit: just noticed Metrix's comment, should have done a round comparison

  
I was waiting for this. Have you accounted for increased electricity pricing over time? ha ha ... anyway, for me it's asthetics. I'd much prefer a roof window but it wasn't feasible. I'd prefer an illume over a normal skylight because - easier installation, no bugs and no heat transfer.

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## phild01

> I was waiting for this. Have you accounted for increased electricity pricing over time? ha ha ... anyway, for me it's asthetics. I'd much prefer a roof window but it wasn't feasible. I'd prefer an illume over a normal skylight because - easier installation, no bugs and no heat transfer.

  I think part of the desire of having a fake skylight is the feeling of not wasting electricity (guilt), albeit how little it amounts to. 
I still believe it would be cheaper to use the light switch, and as I say, natural light is so much better than the fake stuff.  So if you can't get the natural stuff then I would choose the light switch, if you can get natural light then I would do that.  However if you are off the grid or saving on a new electrical circuit, then the illume is a great idea. 
IMO.

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## OBBob

Yes, true.

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## phild01

But having said that, it is appealing that the room is automatically lit.

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## OBBob

> But having said that, it is appealing that the room is automatically lit.

  That's what I meant by asthetics ... you can also leave the lights on or use a sensor I guess ... it just seems different.  
Anyway, this site gives a good insight into the costs of lighting. Verbatim LED Lighting Calculator 
If I ran two LED downlights for 5 hours a day (it's only a bathroom) it'd cost $5/year based on my power cost. It'll only take 70 years to pay off the Illume ... bahahahaha ...  :Smilie:

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## barnes

> That's what I meant by asthetics ... you can also leave the lights on or use a sensor I guess ... it just seems different.  
> Anyway, this site gives a good insight into the costs of lighting. Verbatim LED Lighting Calculator 
> If I ran two LED downlights for 5 hours a day (it's only a bathroom) it'd cost $5/year based on my power cost. It'll only take 70 years to pay off the Illume ... bahahahaha ...

  That's what my wife suggested today. Maybe I should rethink this strategy and try to go the natural skylights route.

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## barnes

So...
Let's say I'll settle for the standard-traditional skylights.
What should I consider more than others from your experience:
1. Flexible shaft skylight.
2. Tubular day lighting system.
3. Vented skylights.

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## OBBob

Which face of your pitched roof were planning on installing them on (North, South, etc.)?  
If money's no object I'd always choose an opening roof window.

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## mudbrick

For a room 2mx2m you only need the equivalent of a normal 60 or 75 watt globe which is about 800lumen so a 400mm would be plenty.
But I'd go natural light for sure wherever possible though.

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## barnes

> Which face of your pitched roof were planning on installing them on (North, South, etc.)?  
> If money's no object I'd always choose an opening roof window.

  I'm thinking about my garage which is almost 53 m2 with a workshop and I have no natural light there. I don't like opening roof window. I had a Velux in Europe and didn't like it. So which one would you go for personally a flexible shaft one or a tubelar one?

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## OBBob

I haven't used the tube skylights, so can't comment. I've used Fakro roof windows, which are not very common in Australia but were very good.

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## CraigandKate

> I haven't used the tube skylights, so can't comment. I've used Fakro roof windows, which are not very common in Australia but were very good.

  You like the Fakro's Bob? I am just looking at them vs the Velux would you use them again?

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## OBBob

> You like the Fakro's Bob? I am just looking at them vs the Velux would you use them again?

  I bought four of them around 9+ years ago, installed them myself and kept that house for 7+ years without issues. I bought them because they had a good deal at the time and were much cheaper than the Velux equivalent. Mine were triple glaze (as in two laminated layers an air gap and another layer of glass), they opened (and came with flyscreens) and were timber inside with metal outside. The nifty thing was (perhaps it's common) ... the window sash unclipped, so you installed the frame and then clipped in the sash. That made it much easier given it was a 45 degree tiled roof with 5.5m high cathedral ceilings.  :Smilie:  I do miss being able to look up through those windows at night ...

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## OBBob

Sent you some pictures.  :Smilie:

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## METRIX

I had FAKRO in one house, they were very easy to install, and manufactured very well, I would use them again,

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## OBBob

> I had FAKRO in one house, they were very easy to install, and manufactured very well, I would use them again,

  They don't seem to have taken off here but I think they're pretty big in Europe.

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## OBBob

They actually came to my house and took professional photos for marketing... but I don't think they every did anything with them (well I've never stumbled on my old house in a magazine ).   :Biggrin:

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## METRIX

> They don't seem to have taken off here but I think they're pretty big in Europe.

  Agree, not sure why as the quality is a good, if not better than VELUX, I do remember it being hard to find an outlet for them, now they have an AU wesite and various distributors.  Skylights, Roof Windows, Access Ladders | FAKRO Australia

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## paddyjoy

The problem with Velux is that Velux Australia are still selling all the old model roof windows from the 1990's, Velux replaced the older style windows years ago in Europe with the Velux Integra windows (which are far superior) however they still sell only the old ones here. Typical us Australians getting saddled again, did I also mention the new integra models are half the price of the old ones currently on sale here.... 
Sorry for the rant I have skylight related PTSD

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## barnes

> They don't seem to have taken off here but I think they're pretty big in Europe.

  Not everywhere. I had never heard of them in most parts of Eastern Europe, but Europe is big...  :Smilie:

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## OBBob

> They are fairly bright, with massive beam spread,  
> They have retail and premium versions, see below for lumen's of each model. 
> 4sqm is a tiny room, a 600mm will burn your eyes out

  Are these literally 10mm thick ( I think I read that somewhere)? i.e. can they be installed anywhere in the ceiling plaster without much consideration for beams etc.

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## METRIX

They are very thin, but you do still need to consider what's behind there.

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## OBBob

Thanks, that image is helpful.

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## phild01

> They are very thin, but you do still need to consider what's behind there.

  That looks like the large diameter LED light I got:  
square ones for Metrix too :Biggrin:

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## METRIX

> That looks like the large diameter LED light I got:   
> square ones for Metrix too

  I purchased one of the square ones, was disappointed, they round the corners off on the outside, and where the diffuser is,  :Mad: 
If I order square I WANT SQUARE not a half roundy squary thingy  :Biggrin:  
MMMM Square

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## OBBob

It's pretty simple product when you look at how that array works.

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## METRIX

I know, there's nothing in them, the LED's are usually arranged on their side around the perimeter on a flexible circuit board, they all shine into the centre, this does away with hot spots which is a common problem with downward facing diodes in the larger fittings. 
Pretty stupid when you think it's taken until now to produce simple energy efficient things like these, humans are really stupid sometimes.

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## barnes

> They are very thin, but you do still need to consider what's behind there.

  
Is this a Premium or a retail version on the photo?

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## METRIX

This is the KIS1014 model Standard range

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## OBBob

The sizing is driving me nuts ... I have an 800lm LED batten globe in a 4x4m room and that's sufficiently bright. So an ~800lm illume should be sufficient for a 2x2m room shouldn't it?? Is their rating comparable to a normal globe?  
I hate lighting ... you need to decide before you actually get to see the result and after that it's hard to change.

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## METRIX

Lighting is easy, it's all stated in Lumens, but you need to determine by technical data where the lumens is being measured, ie at 2m, 3m. 
Yes a 800Lm should be fine in a 2m x 2m, thats a small room. just open it carefully, if it's no good by dry fitting it, pack it back up return it to Bunnings ans say you meant to get the bigger model  :Smilie:  
I have a single  500Lm downlight led in a 3m x 1.5m store room downstairs and it's fine, or it was until I put a big shelf underneath it, now it, sort of ok HA HA HA 
Which one are you looking at ?

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## OBBob

Ha ha, everything is easier when you do it more than once every few years!   :Biggrin:   
I'm looking at a premium 300mm square version. But currently have a bit of confusion because the supplier said it was 850lm... but the spec on the KP website so suggests closer to 1000lm, so just need to check what's being offered.  
The other option is 400mm square but the 1500lm may be too much.

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## Muzza40

300x300 will be plenty in a 2m x 2m room.
300 premium is rated at 1050lm while the retail model is 850lm.
Just be aware that the retail version only comes with a silver trim, while the premium has the option of white or silver.

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## OBBob

> 300x300 will be plenty in a 2m x 2m room.
> 300 premium is rated at 1050lm while the retail model is 850lm.
> Just be aware that the retail version only comes with a silver trim, while the premium has the option of white or silver.

  The retail is 720lm on their website, which is why the 850lm confused me (can't find that figure anywhere). Anyway, I'll get to the bottom of that (probably just crossed wires with supplier). Appreciate your feedback.

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## METRIX

> The retail is 720lm on their website, which is why the 850lm confused me (can't find that figure anywhere). Anyway, I'll get to the bottom of that (probably just crossed wires with supplier). Appreciate your feedback.

  The one in the photo is the 350 retail, this is in a room downstairs with no natural light (or it will be when I fix the ceiling  :Rofl5:  currently it's sitting on a shelf close to the ceiling.
This room is about 4.5m x 2.5m and it lights the room up perfectly when the sun's fully out, when it dims down it's still bright, but at full boar it like daylight in there.

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## Muzza40

The 350mm round retail is brighter than a 400 square. The premium hi spec panel is up around the same lumens as a 600 square.
 About 2200 i think from memory.
They are only 10mm thick and can go directly underneath ceiling battens etc. The only time you can get into trouble is if there is timber running right aling the edge of the hole as it makes it hard to get the clips in.

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## OBBob

Yes, the round ones do very well on the output but won't sit as well. Remember (thanks to Phil) this is purely an aesthetic folly.   :Frown:

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## phild01

> Yes, the round ones do very well on the output but won't sit as well. Remember (thanks to Phil) this is purely an aesthetic folly.

   Darn, was about to suggest the light switch again (just kidding) :Biggrin:

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## OBBob

> Darn, was about to suggest the light switch again (just kidding)

  I'm actually with you on this Phil... but I won't soon forgive you for pointing out that it'll take about 50 years for me to break even on these vs LED down light running costs... Ha ha.

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## METRIX

IMO: They should break all the machines which produce round things

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## OBBob

> IMO: They should break all the machines which produce round things

  Didn't you just say you're putting a round illume in your place?

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## phild01

> IMO: They should break all the machines which produce round things

  Your ute won't go very far with square wheels.

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## SilentButDeadly

Roundish is no less comfortable. 
Ours is not to reason why. Merely to point and giggle.

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## METRIX

> Your ute won't go very far with square wheels.

  Exactly my point, it's those round wheels which are holding  us back from levitating cars,  :Smilie:   :Smilie:  
Mythbusters how funny https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIN8Q_4iaxU

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## Bustertee

I installed a square illume in our kitchen few years back, wasn't very hard & I didn't have to remove any roof tiles. It works great however, the only downside is no light comes through at nights where moon is bright  :No: .

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## smokyjoe

I'm tossing up between a roof window, a tubular skylight, and an illume to light up my kitchen. I've never seen a tubular skylight in the flesh. Do tubular skylights (with a diffuser) look like a fluroscent or LED light? Can you tell the difference between an illume and a tubular skylight?

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## OBBob

> ... Can you tell the difference between an illume and a tubular skylight?

  at night you can't see the moon (as pointed out above).  :Smilie:

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## OBBob

Well two Illumes were just delivered. It's dark, so I can't try them for their actual purpose... but the solar panels are surprisingly heavy and solid feeling and the unit itself is metal encased. I got the silver metal surround version and was a little surprised to see it is real metal not just silver plastic.

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## phild01

Noticed the fake solar skylights at Aldi today for $99, and they are round ones. :Smilie:

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## OBBob

So finally giving the feedback on the Illumes. It was a bit of a saga that I brought on myself. Basically I was so wrapped up in how good a solution it was that I neglected to put sufficient effort into selling it to other project stakeholders J. Basically, that translates to – I temporarily installed one in the previous bathroom before mirrors, tiling or painting were done and it was a cloudy day with just the panel sitting flat in the driveway. I could extrapolate in my mind how it would look when installed properly but first impressions count and it ended up being replaced with a real window on this occasion. 
Anyway, fast forward to yesterday … just finishing off the last bathroom and my wife asks if I still have those solar skylight things, perhaps we should try them in this room (which has no external walls for a window). And … surprise surprise, they look great and bath it in light … so much so we keep going to turn the lights off at the switch when we walk past. Turning on the 1000 lumen pendant light just adds some yellow to the room J. They were very easy to install, took a couple of hours to fit the two light panels in the plaster ceiling, attach the solar panels to the roof and run the cables through the roof space.

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## METRIX

> Noticed the fake solar skylights at Aldi today for $99, and they are round ones.

  
Well that says it all, if it's round forget it, it won't work :0

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## METRIX

I am in the process of finishing off my Laundry, ended up dividing the room into a 2800 x 1200 (tradesman bathroom), and a 3000 x 2500 (laundry), I originally had one illume in there as posted above this lit up the entire room when it was one room, the wiring runs up the upstairs cavity walls onto the roof, due to lining all the walls upstairs now I cannot get access to the roof from the downstairs and would have liked to put a second smaller unit in the bathroom, the room downstairs is all single brick with new linings. 
Anyway the one above is now in the laundry part of the room, the walls are painted white with white cabinetry / white tiles (floor still to be done), when the thing is on, it lights the entire room up like it has a real skylight, I can vouch for the product as an alternative to a real skylight without the pitfalls that go with a real skylight. 
Actually also thinking about it, the solar panel was out there when we got hit with the Hail storm a few weeks ago, I didn't even think about it, the laserlight roof on the pergola got destroyed, but the solar panel is perfect.   
Them there balls coming from the sky are Golfball sized.

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## METRIX

> The problem with Velux is that Velux Australia are still selling all the old model roof windows from the 1990's, Velux replaced the older style windows years ago in Europe with the Velux Integra windows (which are far superior) however they still sell only the old ones here. Typical us Australians getting saddled again, did I also mention the new integra models are half the price of the old ones currently on sale here.... 
> Sorry for the rant I have skylight related PTSD

  What extra superiority does the Integra give over out models, we have the same touchpads, solar panel operation, glazing options as the overseas models, triple glazing not an option here. 
Integra has a timber core with plastic surrounds, our versions are BAL40 rated which is becoming a bigger issue with all the BAL location changes now, the Integra would not get a BAL rating due to it's construction.

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## phild01

Definitely laserlite and not Alsynite?

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## METRIX

> Definitely laserlite and not Alsynite?

  c
Can't say, suspect Laserlite it's 5-rib pattern so I assume Laserlite.

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## phild01

Polycarbonate is extremely tough and unlikely to get holes in it.  On the other hand, fibre reinforced polyester is another story.  Then there was PVC which gets very brittle.

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## METRIX

> Polycarbonate is extremely tough and unlikely to get holes in it.  On the other hand, fibre reinforced polyester is another story.  Then there was PVC which gets very brittle.

  i
It not fiber reinforced, looks like Laserlite 2000 / 3000, but who knows as no identifying marks, all I know is it's full of holes now  :Mad:

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## phild01

Maybe it was polycarbonate that was installed upside down.  Not sure what happens when that is done.

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## METRIX

Could be, everything else in this house was installed backwards or wrong, so you could be right, I think when it's upside down it get affected by UV.

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## METRIX

> Polycarbonate is extremely tough and unlikely to get holes in it.  On the other hand, fibre reinforced polyester is another story.  Then there was PVC which gets very brittle.

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## phild01

I did say holes, I think you would find a hailstone the size of a cricket ball would bounce off, but if it did break it, it would likely crack it rather than put a hole in it...IMO.
Did you sort the " ' " thingy?

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